Author Topic: Calvinist Fundies  (Read 8040 times)

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Offline rageaholic

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Calvinist Fundies
« on: March 04, 2012, 08:22:04 pm »
Is it just me, or do those who hold Calvinist beliefs tend to have the most warped and fucked up views?  They also say the most darndest things that are hard to tell if they are joking or not.  Example, this douchebag.  He outright admits the god only cares about glory and glorifies himself by causing billions to suffer (implying eternal damnation).  I honestly can't think of a more evil and despicable being than that.  But since Vincent here is one of the "elect", he sees nothing wrong with that.  In fact, he thinks the victims of this diety are the ones who think too highly of themselves if they think their suffering isn't worth gawds precious fucking glory. 

It's the perfect example of what an inhumane, sociopathic, and nonesensical theology it is.  Some other arguements...

-Everyone deserves hell (because of Adams sin), therefore god is gracious in saving some people from such a fate (justifying limited atonement).

-When taken further into hyper calvinism, they claim that God controls everything and uses everything for his glory, even evil and hell (which explains the mindset behind the above quote).  They use abusive verses comparing humans to clay pots to remind of that we are god's property.  I should also note that Westboro Baptist are hyper Calvinists.  THAT should tell you a lot. 

-They are completely unsympathetic toward the suffering of others.  Since they think everyone deserves hell, they say no one has the right to complain about suffering. 

-They are obsessed with sementics and will twist them to cover contradictions.  How can a god of love create people just to send them to hell (or even create such a place to begin with)?  Well we're confused with the "secular" definition of love.  God's idea of "love" is higher than ours.  They also twist verses that claim all will be saved to mean only the elect. 

-They accuse others or being prideful for ignoring the scriptural support for predestination.  Yes, these are the "elect" accusing others of pride.  Of we're probably confused with the secular definintion of pride.   ::)

-When people question the morality of Calvinism, they will try to get philosophical.  "Wrong by who'se standards?" they'll say.  Since we can't point to an objective source of morality (their evil god), we obviously can't say anything is wrong.  Even if an action causes suffering, they'll ask why suffering is wrong.  Ultimately, their arguements will come down to "god's ways our higher than ours" so just shut up and accept.  Even though they can't give ANY OBJECTIVE PROOF THAT THEIR GOD EXISTS, they are right and we're wrong.

Just to see another example of the fruits of Calvinism, look in the comments of this article.  Search for a poster named "Calvin" and you'll see just how arrogant and terrifying these people are.  In his first post, he actually admits that he will be happy with god's judgement if he sends his son to hell.  When people call him out on it, he gets defensive of his "holy and righteous god" and starts attacking people, actually praising god's "justice".  Again, people tell him that most Christians on that site they get along with fine, but that Calvin is being a real asshole.  He then says that he's not there to get anyone to like him, he's just preaching the truth.  Later along the line, he admits that when he's in heaven, he will rejoice in seeing others sent to hell.  A real class act.   ::)

I can't say for sure, but it sounds like John Calvin and other reformed theologians were trying to answer the problem of evil.  However, in doing so, they create a theology which is evil.  It encourages unfairness (the elect bullshit) and brings out Darkness Induced Audience Apathy.  I'm not a fan of arminism or any theology which condemns people to eternal torment, but at least the other ones aren't nearly as cold or depressing as Calvinism. 

Offline gyeonghwa

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Re: Calvinist Fundies
« Reply #1 on: March 04, 2012, 08:34:48 pm »
Is it just me, or do those who hold Calvinist beliefs tend to have the most warped and fucked up views?

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Offline RavynousHunter

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Re: Calvinist Fundies
« Reply #2 on: March 04, 2012, 08:50:38 pm »
Nope...pretty much everyone but Calvinists think Calvinists are utter shitheads, and that their god is a monster.
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Offline Mechtaur

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Re: Calvinist Fundies
« Reply #3 on: March 04, 2012, 09:11:48 pm »
The one thing I even find remotely respectable about the Calvinist sect is that they at least acknowledge what life means if Yahweh is completely omnipotent and omniscient.

But, remote respect isn't really worth mentioning.

Offline Osama bin Bambi

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Re: Calvinist Fundies
« Reply #4 on: March 04, 2012, 09:17:22 pm »
Let's put it this way: Rapture Ready makes fun of Calvinists. One user has a signature that says, "I would be a Calvinist, but I guess it wasn't meant to be."
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Offline rageaholic

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Re: Calvinist Fundies
« Reply #5 on: March 04, 2012, 10:30:29 pm »
The one thing I even find remotely respectable about the Calvinist sect is that they at least acknowledge what life means if Yahweh is completely omnipotent and omniscient.

But, remote respect isn't really worth mentioning.

Yeah, they don't skit around the issue of free will and evil.  That's probably because they become evil when they hold onto such soul sucking views.

Let's put it this way: Rapture Ready makes fun of Calvinists. One user has a signature that says, "I would be a Calvinist, but I guess it wasn't meant to be."

Wow...

Even insanity has standards.  They may be insane, but they are not soulless (at least not completely). 

Let me put it this way, most fundies and apologists would visit a cancer ward and try to rationalize the suffering into god's mighty plan.  To them, the suffering will strengthen the soul for heaven, or allow others to preach the good news.  As crazy as that might sound, at least they have good intentions.

The Calvinist would just see this as an evil sinner getting their just deserts.  Or if they're feeling really spiteful, god's mercy for not immediately casting them into hell. 

I'd take a cloud cuckoolander or well intentioned extremest over a complete monster any day. 

Offline Auri-El

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Re: Calvinist Fundies
« Reply #6 on: March 04, 2012, 11:08:09 pm »
My parents are Calvinists (I think). Not quite that extreme, they're not really vocal about it, but they do have some messed up views. They aren't unsympathetic to suffering, but they do believe that it's part of God's plan and that all we can do is "grin and bear it." The biggest difference between them and some of the wackier Calvinists is that while they kind of believe in predestination, they say that "since we don't know, it's our job to convert as many people as possible." They genuinely believe if they don't witness to people every chance they get, they're going to be held accountable for that person going to hell.

Offline The Right Honourable Mlle Antéchrist

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Re: Calvinist Fundies
« Reply #7 on: March 05, 2012, 03:27:32 am »
Let's put it this way: Rapture Ready makes fun of Calvinists. One user has a signature that says, "I would be a Calvinist, but I guess it wasn't meant to be."

Eh, RR's doctrine has some Calvinist leanings, even if they're not always quite so overt about it. The free will they speak of strikes me as rather superficial, what with the talk of god already knowing every single outcome in advance, and the occasional throwing around of catchphrases like "Many are called, few are chosen".

Now, if you want to see bald-face Calvinism taken to its extremes, look no further than the WBC.
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Offline rookie

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Re: Calvinist Fundies
« Reply #8 on: March 05, 2012, 04:42:18 pm »


Now, if you want to see bald-face Calvinism taken to its extremes, look no further than the WBC.

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Offline StallChaser

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Re: Calvinist Fundies
« Reply #9 on: March 06, 2012, 03:19:43 am »
Calvinism is probably the best argument ever made for sin and debauchery.  So we can't change what happens to us?  Fuck it, lets have as much fun as possible while it still lasts!

Offline The Right Honourable Mlle Antéchrist

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Re: Calvinist Fundies
« Reply #10 on: March 06, 2012, 07:55:40 am »
After all, that wild, naked romp of gambling, booze and drug-fueled sex is all part of god's plan. Can you imagine god sitting there like, "And then Bob will do a line of coke off of a hooker's ass crack. Let it be so."?
« Last Edit: March 06, 2012, 07:58:40 am by Mlle Antéchrist »
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Offline Old Viking

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Re: Calvinist Fundies
« Reply #11 on: March 07, 2012, 06:38:28 pm »
Calvinism is silliness with a mordant twist.
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Offline Atheissimo

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Re: Calvinist Fundies
« Reply #12 on: March 07, 2012, 07:07:37 pm »
IMHO Calvinism is everything that is wrong with modern Christianity (or Christianity at any time, actually). They freely admit that their God is a jealous, petty, genocidal tyrant, but they don't care because they think they've gotten on his good side. It's the ultimate in shitheadedness and lack of care for others. If they were anywhere near as moral or good as they claim to be they would ditch or actively oppose such a monster, but they've sided with the playground bully and fuck everyone else. It's the most transparent example of Christianity as revenge fantasy, the way they sic their God on everybody like their own personal attack dog.

Without Godwinning myself too badly, it's like signing up for the SS as soon as it looks like ol' Adolf might be going places. What's even more annoying is that pointing out all the terrible stuff God does in the Bible doesn't work on them. On your regular white-bread Church of England type it causes them to go into all sorts of apologetic gymnastics and hand waving, but Calvinists are so convinced they've kissed the right ass that they'll justify anything (they think) God did or wants to do because anything he does is automatically moral and right. And they seem so  smug about it too because they genuinely believe that everyone who opposes them will be tortured for eternity while they watch from their ring-side seats, stroking away with Princess Palm and her five lovely daughters. Watch them trying to outdo each other in being the most worthless and unworthy, believing that every crawling syllable brings them closer to safety.

They say atheism de-values humanity, what about when you consider the average moral Christian to be less than dirt? Where does that leave the people they consider to be evil?

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« Last Edit: March 07, 2012, 07:17:11 pm by Atheissimo »
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Offline rageaholic

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Re: Calvinist Fundies
« Reply #13 on: March 07, 2012, 08:59:04 pm »
My parents are Calvinists (I think). Not quite that extreme, they're not really vocal about it, but they do have some messed up views. They aren't unsympathetic to suffering, but they do believe that it's part of God's plan and that all we can do is "grin and bear it." The biggest difference between them and some of the wackier Calvinists is that while they kind of believe in predestination, they say that "since we don't know, it's our job to convert as many people as possible." They genuinely believe if they don't witness to people every chance they get, they're going to be held accountable for that person going to hell.

The bolded part is also common in some arminianist circles (I think Baptists).  It's a scary and enraging belief.  It's horrible to think that you have the eternal fate of so many people in your hands, especially if you're a shy person.  It's also typical blame the victim.  God blames you for being forced to send people to hell. 

This sounds more like four point Calvinism to me.  They reject limited atonement go with the idea that God knew who would reject and accept Christ.  It still sounds like a crap shoot though.  Just a crap shoot you have more control over.

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Re: Calvinist Fundies
« Reply #14 on: March 08, 2012, 12:56:34 am »
After all, that wild, naked romp of gambling, booze and drug-fueled sex is all part of god's plan. Can you imagine god sitting there like, "And then Bob will do a line of coke off of a hooker's ass crack. Let it be so."?

He certainly never stops that sort of thing.