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Community => Politics and Government => Topic started by: I am lizard on August 12, 2014, 04:01:23 pm

Title: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 12, 2014, 04:01:23 pm
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/11/st-louis-protesters-officer-teenager (http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/11/st-louis-protesters-officer-teenager)
Police shoot black kid for supposedly stealing candy.
Title: Re: Ferguson muder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on August 12, 2014, 05:16:11 pm
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/11/st-louis-protesters-officer-teenager (http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/11/st-louis-protesters-officer-teenager)
Police shoot black kid for supposedly stealing candy.

This is why I thought that cartoon about "Dangerous Perceptions" was bullshit people.
Would you please stop harping about that cartoon?  It made a good point.
Title: Re: Ferguson muder
Post by: I am lizard on August 12, 2014, 08:59:49 pm
So no one has anything to say?
Wonderful.
Title: Re: Ferguson muder
Post by: SCarpelan on August 12, 2014, 09:15:58 pm
There isn't much to say that hasn't been said elsewhere. More evidence that black people are seen threatening and the more angry protesters having started looting isn't helping to change this view.
Title: Re: Ferguson muder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on August 12, 2014, 09:50:26 pm
Mods, could you just delete this.
Why?  There's no need to delete this.
Title: Re: Ferguson muder
Post by: I am lizard on August 12, 2014, 09:56:06 pm
Sorry, just depressed and confused.
I'm still not sure what to feel about the other killing.
EDIT:
This cheered me up
(http://www.toonhole.com/comics/2014-08-08-215_RequestingBackUp.jpg)
Title: Re: Ferguson muder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 12, 2014, 11:21:22 pm
Hooray, a new incident to give my friend's racist roommate something to harass me about!
Title: Re: Ferguson muder
Post by: I am lizard on August 12, 2014, 11:22:22 pm
Hooray, a new incident to give my friend's racist roommate something to harass me about!
The murder?
If he brings up the looting remind him of soccer riots.
Title: Re: Ferguson muder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 12, 2014, 11:26:17 pm
Hooray, a new incident to give my friend's racist roommate something to harass me about!
The murder?
If he brings up the looting remind him of soccer riots.

It's to the point where I just ignore the guy when he goes into his douchey attitude. As my friend likes the guy (and is unsurprisingly his only real friend), he tends to take his side when we clash.

It doesn't mean that I want to have him making racist jokes just to get a rise out of me.
Title: Re: Ferguson muder
Post by: Dakota Bob on August 13, 2014, 04:41:15 am
Wouldn't be surprised if the police officer who killed this guy got off scot-free.
Title: Re: Ferguson muder
Post by: SCarpelan on August 13, 2014, 05:49:02 am
I would be at least a bit surprised if that would be the case. The feds are doing their own investigation on the issue and they should be more impartial than the local police.
Title: Re: Ferguson muder
Post by: Old Viking on August 13, 2014, 07:21:10 pm
Just a random thought here.  How about we learn the details -- including what motivated the shooting -- before we cast our votes?
Title: Re: Ferguson muder
Post by: Second Coming of Madman on August 13, 2014, 10:54:30 pm
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/08/13/overkill-images-from-ferguson-protest-show-cops-treating-city-like-a-war-zone/

Oh, god.

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/08/13/watch-live-protests-continue-in-ferguson-despite-heavy-police-presence/

Why the hell hasn't the Guard been mobilized?
Title: Re: Ferguson muder
Post by: Askold on August 13, 2014, 11:28:18 pm
Two reporters were arrested, this is what happened when a third one asked about them:

Quote
I just called Ferguson police chief to ask about @WesleyLowery and @ryanjreilly, told him what I knew. His response: "Oh, God."

...Ok. Didn't the chief of police know about the arrest? Because this is yet another implication that the cops on the scene are getting out of control. And having snipers AIMING at unarmed protestors? Why on Earth would you do that? Assault rifles drawn at UNARMED protestors?

That is not how you contain a peaceful protest. I understand police being there, I understand the need to be cautious, but this is not how you handle a protest or even a riot.

I see them armed for Fallujah rather than a riot. Where are the riot shields, water cannons, tear gas and shotguns with beanbag ammo? Even those should not be used against a peaceful protest BUT AT LEAST I would understand having them as a precaution in case the protest turns into a riot. These guys aren't prepared to contain anything, they are armed to KILL the rioters. I am seriously questioning their training and though processes.
Title: Re: Ferguson muder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on August 13, 2014, 11:29:47 pm
Two reporters were arrested, this is what happened when a third one asked about them:

Quote
I just called Ferguson police chief to ask about @WesleyLowery and @ryanjreilly, told him what I knew. His response: "Oh, God."

...Ok. Didn't the chief of police know about the arrest? Because this is yet another implication that the cops on the scene are getting out of control. And having snipers AIMING at unarmed protestors? Why on Earth would you do that? Assault rifles drawn at UNARMED protestors?

That is not how you contain a peaceful protest. I understand police being there, I understand the need to be cautious, but this is not how you handle a protest or even a riot.

I see them armed for Fallujah rather than a riot. Where are the riot shields, water cannons, tear gas and shotguns with beanbag ammo? Even those should not be used against a peaceful protest BUT AT LEAST I would understand having them as a precaution in case the protest turns into a riot. These guys aren't prepared to contain anything, they are armed to KILL the rioters. I am seriously questioning their training and though processes.
I think it's a symptom of the paranoia all too common in law enforcement since 9/11.
Title: Re: Ferguson muder
Post by: I am lizard on August 14, 2014, 12:27:12 am
Gun safety 101: don't aim your weapon at anything you do not plan on shooting at.

This means the cops were either planning of slaughtering dozens of protestors, or they're idiots who shouldn't be allowed to hold anything more dangerous than a nerf gun.
Title: Re: Ferguson muder
Post by: Second Coming of Madman on August 14, 2014, 01:15:35 am
On second thought, the Guard would most likely fuck it up. My father's attempts to get the Alabama Guard to give up the Apache for the Blackhawk were unsuccessful, at the very least.

Title: Re: Ferguson muder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 14, 2014, 01:24:22 am
Welp, we can officially call this a free speech issue. But they totally CAN'T be restricting our freedoms, they're not taking away our guns! It's almost like GUN DON'T FUCKING MATTER WHEN FREE SPEECH IS ON THE LINE.

Also, had someone on Twitter tell me that the police did interview the victim's friend. Anyone got a source for that? He didn't. Same guy also tried to say the officer aiming his sniper rifle was just using the scope to get a better view.
Title: Re: Ferguson muder
Post by: Svata on August 14, 2014, 01:38:37 am
Gun safety 101: don't aim your weapon at anything you do not plan on shooting at.

This means the cops were either planning of slaughtering dozens of protestors, or they're idiots who shouldn't be allowed to hold anything more dangerous than a nerf gun.

That was literally the first thing I was taught when learning how to shoot. The second was "keep your finger outside of the trigger guard until you're ready to shoot".
Title: Re: Ferguson muder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 14, 2014, 10:46:28 am
Welp, we can officially call this a free speech issue. But they totally CAN'T be restricting our freedoms, they're not taking away our guns! It's almost like GUN DON'T FUCKING MATTER WHEN FREE SPEECH IS ON THE LINE.

What the fuck does this have to do with gun control?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Askold on August 14, 2014, 12:09:01 pm
http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/scrutiny-police-response-increases-ferguson-24973520

Quote
County Police Chief Jon Belmar said his officers have responded with "an incredible amount of restraint" as they've had rocks and bottles thrown at them, been shot at and had two dozen patrol vehicles destroyed.

So the protesters have actually used firearms? And there are also several claims that the protestors have been wildly rioting and looting stores. Granted that these claims come from people who describe the protestors as "chimps" and "nignogs" and talk about chimpout unironically so I am not taking those claims seriously until I see actual citations and proof.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 14, 2014, 12:20:34 pm
http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/scrutiny-police-response-increases-ferguson-24973520

Quote
County Police Chief Jon Belmar said his officers have responded with "an incredible amount of restraint" as they've had rocks and bottles thrown at them, been shot at and had two dozen patrol vehicles destroyed.

So the protesters have actually used firearms? And there are also several claims that the protestors have been wildly rioting and looting stores. Granted that these claims come from people who describe the protestors as "chimps" and "nignogs" and talk about chimpout unironically so I am not taking those claims seriously until I see actual citations and proof.

I've seen absolutely zero evidence that the police have been shot at. The protests have received massive coverage from all angles (despite the police trying to clamp down on media illegally), and there is no sign of gunshots from anyone other than police.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 14, 2014, 12:20:50 pm
Welp, we can officially call this a free speech issue. But they totally CAN'T be restricting our freedoms, they're not taking away our guns! It's almost like GUN DON'T FUCKING MATTER WHEN FREE SPEECH IS ON THE LINE.

What the fuck does this have to do with gun control?

Exactly. Gun nuts love to spew on about how they need guns to defend freedom, but conveniently are no where to be seen when free speech is on the line. In my rage, I didn't exactly word it very well.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Nemo on August 14, 2014, 12:56:20 pm
Shouldn't the NRA types be chiming in any moment now about how this is why we need guns, this is the tyranny they've all warned us about?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: R. U. Sirius on August 14, 2014, 01:29:20 pm
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/john-a-tures/the-group-gun-owners-of-a_b_5677182.html?ncid=txtlnkusaolp00000592 (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/john-a-tures/the-group-gun-owners-of-a_b_5677182.html?ncid=txtlnkusaolp00000592)

There's the response from gun advocates so far.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Damen on August 14, 2014, 02:25:15 pm
Oh Jesus Christ, I can't believe something that should be causing us to focusing on Barny Fife in an MRAP is being hijacked for gun control. But, okay, I'll bite. Here, let me go to one of the more popular gun blogs and see what I can dig up on this situation.

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2014/08/robert-farago/incendiary-image-day-ferguson-mo-armed-self-defense-editon/ (http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2014/08/robert-farago/incendiary-image-day-ferguson-mo-armed-self-defense-editon/)
(http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2014/08/tyler-kee/argument-gun-control-ferguson-mo/)
(http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2014/08/daniel-zimmerman/st-louis-cabelas-protects-guns-rioters/)
http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2014/08/robert-farago/police-shooting-leads-neighborhood-looting/ (http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2014/08/robert-farago/police-shooting-leads-neighborhood-looting/)
http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2014/08/tyler-kee/predictable-outcomes-in-ferguson-mo/ (http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2014/08/tyler-kee/predictable-outcomes-in-ferguson-mo/)
http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2014/08/robert-farago/breaking-militarized-missouri-police-go-rogue-in-riots/ (http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2014/08/robert-farago/breaking-militarized-missouri-police-go-rogue-in-riots/)

Eh, and here's another from a different website, just for shits and giggles.

http://www.ammoland.com/2014/08/gun-sales-skyrocket-in-st-louis-in-wake-of-riots/ (http://www.ammoland.com/2014/08/gun-sales-skyrocket-in-st-louis-in-wake-of-riots/)

Remember, kids, just because HuffPo isn't reporting it doesn't mean it isn't being talked about.

But my biggest concern here isn't the silence of the NRA or the GOA, but rather what I stated at the beginning of my post: continued police militarization. I'm sorry, but I am of the firm belief that if Sheriff Andy and Deputy Fife can't deal with a situation with standard police equipment and instead need level 3 ballistic vests, camouflage, grenade launchers and landmine resistant trucks then it's time to call in the National fucking Guard. Leave the military actions to the god damn military.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/06/09/us/war-gear-flows-to-police-departments.html (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/06/09/us/war-gear-flows-to-police-departments.html)

Quote
NEENAH, Wis. — Inside the municipal garage of this small lakefront city, parked next to the hefty orange snowplow, sits an even larger truck, this one painted in desert khaki. Weighing 30 tons and built to withstand land mines, the armored combat vehicle is one of hundreds showing up across the country, in police departments big and small.

The 9-foot-tall armored truck was intended for an overseas battlefield. But as President Obama ushers in the end of what he called America’s “long season of war,” the former tools of combat — M-16 rifles, grenade launchers, silencers and more — are ending up in local police departments, often with little public notice.

During the Obama administration, according to Pentagon data, police departments have received tens of thousands of machine guns; nearly 200,000 ammunition magazines; thousands of pieces of camouflage and night-vision equipment; and hundreds of silencers, armored cars and aircraft.

The equipment has been added to the armories of police departments that already look and act like military units. Police SWAT teams are now deployed tens of thousands of times each year, increasingly for routine jobs. Masked, heavily armed police officers in Louisiana raided a nightclub in 2006 as part of a liquor inspection. In Florida in 2010, officers in SWAT gear and with guns drawn carried out raids on barbershops that mostly led only to charges of “barbering without a license.”

Besides, I thought we were supposed to be "getting weapons of war off our streets." What happened to that?

God damn it, now I've pissed myself off. I'll be in the angry dome.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 14, 2014, 02:31:29 pm
Who the hell is making this about gun control? We're just pointing out the irony of the rhetoric that gun nuts spew in regards to the situation in Ferguson.

EDIT: Also, first link: Gun owners defending against looters, not defending against police abuse, also a completely editorialized article that puts words into peoples' mouths. Second link: About looting, not guns. Third link: About gun sales, not the protests. Fourth link: Not about guns. Fifth link: About gun sales, not the protests.

Not to mention that, again, the mention of gun rights groups isn't about gun control, its about the hypocrisy and irony of their "we use guns to protect our rights" rhetoric. Furthermore, the only night with rioting was Sunday night.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: TheUnknown on August 14, 2014, 08:51:56 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GO1SKC6dK7o

And some lovely comments:

Quote
Quote
They don't have the right to tell you to do that, and certainly not the right to shoot at you with rubber bullets if you don't listen.

Actually they do have the right to get you off the streets. It isn't your say to be over the power of the law. They were keeping them safe till they threw bricks. They shouldn't have been protesting over a death of a child. This thing happens every day but nobody cares till "the police brutality" shit started.

Quote
Protesting at night. Isn't that what caused the looting and the fires? Unfortunatly these people can't be trusted to not destroy the town and need to be watched and told by police to go home. 

Quote
It isn't a race fight. There are many reasons things happen to the races. White men get called out on doing wrong things, Latino community gets called out on stereotypical things and the black community gets called out for their own problems. The reason these races get called out is because of how we make ourselves out to be towards others.

They treat the blacks and Latinos this way only because we make ourselves seem bad.

Black people came and started to look from grocery stores and side stores after this happened. Obviously nobody cares.. It's just another death

Every single thing that happens is justified because looting.  That's what a lot of these situations seem to boil down to.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: SCarpelan on August 14, 2014, 09:11:09 pm
Every single thing that happens is justified because looting.  That's what a lot of these situations seem to boil down to.
That's why I was annoyed at the looters. They gave these assholes the excuse they need to justify the police action in their minds and takes the attention away from the actual protest. I understand the anger and the public reaction turning against the protesters is unjustified even with the looting but it was still a dumb move.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 14, 2014, 10:41:58 pm
Okay, so since this topic hasn't gotten much attention I'll post about everything that's been going on since.

* As you see in the video, cops fired on a peaceful protest with tear gas and rubber buckshot, and other photos show them with pepperball guns. No evidence that any actual live ammunition has been fired, though the cops have made spurious claims of the protesters shooting that are not backed up by any other evidence. A limited amount of looting and burning was done on the first night of the protests, and has not been repeated. Despite claims by the police of over a dozen cop cars being destroyed by rioters, there is likewise no evidence.

* The Huffington Post and Washington Post had reporters in a local McDonalds filming the action. The county police (the riot cop/SWAT guys) burst in to kick everyone out, then arrested the reporters for not moving fast enough. The St. Louis chief of police was called and had no idea this was going on. Apparently the riot cops were essentially acting with no higher authority to control them and were basically allowed to roam free and act out their wannabe soldier power trips.

* Al-Jazeera's reporters were shot with rubber buckshot and had a tear gas canister fired at them despite very obviously being the press (they had cameras and lights on tripods set up). The police came after driving them off and dismantled their gear. They later attempted to claim that the reporters were shot at by accident and the police hustled them into an APC for their safety and were just taking down their gear to help pack up. The reporters have called bullshit on them.

* This afternoon, the governor officially pulled the county police out and had them replaced with the state police, led by Capt. Johnson (a black man who grew up in the neighborhood), which included many black cops. Shockingly enough, treating the protesters like human beings and allowing them to peacefully address their grievances calmed everything down immediately.

* The protesters marched peacefully for the rest of the day and night, accompanied by regular uniformed police with no riot gear. Someone in the crowd was injured by a vehicle or fell ill and a police SUV took her to the hospital, with the New Black Panthers acting as impromptu traffic police. The St. Louis police chief arrived to meet with the protesters and take selfies (http://i.imgur.com/SGdaC6h.jpg).

* NYC and St. Louis held their own protests. The NYPD temporarily corralled the protesters and 4 people were arrested (including Jason Woody, one of the big Occupy protesters), but the rest were allowed to exit the area. A live streamer filming it attempted to stir up the crowd by screaming that the cops would arrest thousands, but everyone in the crowd told him to shut the fuck up.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on August 14, 2014, 10:52:11 pm
Amazing....treating people like people actually works!

Ironbite-just amazing how dumb these cops are.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 14, 2014, 10:53:01 pm
http://fox2now.com/2014/08/14/despite-reports-swat-team-helped-al-jazeera-reporters-did-not-take-their-equipment/

Well, this article came up. Sorry if I don't exactly trust the county police because I have yet to see the Al-Jazeera crew that this happened to make a statement.

EDIT: Oh, hey, Here's the first person account. (http://america.aljazeera.com/watch/shows/live-news/2014/8/al-jazeera-americareportergetshitwithteargasinferguson.html) Guess what he doesn't say the police did?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on August 14, 2014, 10:54:48 pm
I think the main problem is that the militarization of the police since 9/11 has led all too many cops to think of themselves as soldiers.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 15, 2014, 12:14:33 am
I think the main problem is that the militarization of the police since 9/11 has led all too many cops to think of themselves as soldiers.
I'd imagine a number of things cause police brutality.
A big factor is definitely the widespread fear of the mentally ill, homeless, and minorities among cops.

Say, side topic, but one idea i really liked was to have all cops be required to wear a camera that would be constantly recording.
If there was ever a report of brutality someone could look over the tapes to see if what happened was justified.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 15, 2014, 01:14:34 am
http://fox2now.com/2014/08/14/despite-reports-swat-team-helped-al-jazeera-reporters-did-not-take-their-equipment/

Well, this article came up. Sorry if I don't exactly trust the county police because I have yet to see the Al-Jazeera crew that this happened to make a statement.

EDIT: Oh, hey, Here's the first person account. (http://america.aljazeera.com/watch/shows/live-news/2014/8/al-jazeera-americareportergetshitwithteargasinferguson.html) Guess what he doesn't say the police did?

Yeah, the reporters themselves have called out the SWAT for their assault. The claim that it was an accident and that they were helping pack up the reporter's gear for them to evacuate is a Communist China-style obvious lie.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Lt. Fred on August 15, 2014, 02:44:38 am
So it's obviously just a police riot. Obviously none of the responsible will be punished, but perhaps some of the victims may escape legal repercussions.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 15, 2014, 11:32:06 am
So it's obviously just a police riot. Obviously none of the responsible will be punished, but perhaps some of the victims may escape legal repercussions.

All of the victims have escaped any repercussions. Just because they arrest people doesn't mean they have any charges to file; the reporters were released almost immediately afterward. It was a scare tactic to try and force the journalists to stop covering their crimes, but unfortunately for them we're not enough of a cyberpunk dystopia that they can actually do that much to stop them. Nobody's getting disappeared in the night.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 15, 2014, 11:34:20 am
What needs to happen is the county needs to pass the investigation to the state as they proved last night that they actually care, then both county and city need to be looked at, investigated and, ideally, replaced.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Askold on August 15, 2014, 01:15:34 pm
http://canonicalmomentum.tumblr.com/post/94719029772/stacksbreadup-fuck-respectability-politics

If these are true then the state troopers should take over the deskjobs from the local police in that town as well.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on August 15, 2014, 01:35:31 pm
How far does the rot go?

Ironbite-also they released the name of the killer, a Derren Wilson.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 15, 2014, 01:39:02 pm
Oh hey, the name doesn't match the leak, which is exactly why I was telling people to be 100% certain before they post the information.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: TheUnknown on August 15, 2014, 05:04:36 pm
http://news.yahoo.com/turmoil-tear-gas-way-hope-ferguson-053336976.html (http://news.yahoo.com/turmoil-tear-gas-way-hope-ferguson-053336976.html)

Quote
The robber took a box of Swisher Sweets Cigars valued at $48.99. The suspects were identified as 18-year-old Michael Brown and 22-year-old Dorian Johnson, according to the reports.

. . .

Johnson, Brown's friend, told investigators that Brown "did take cigarillos," his attorney, Freeman Bosley, told MSNBC. Bosley said he was aware of video but had not seen it.

And the comments are almost completely disgusting racist shit.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 15, 2014, 05:40:49 pm
The cop still had know waking of knowing this and even if he did, you don't shoot a suspect.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 15, 2014, 05:59:39 pm
And even if the shooting officer had known about it, what relevance is there to the case? It's innocent until proven guilty, not innocent until shot dead.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: niam2023 on August 15, 2014, 06:05:50 pm
Okay, so since this topic hasn't gotten much attention I'll post about everything that's been going on since.

* As you see in the video, cops fired on a peaceful protest with tear gas and rubber buckshot, and other photos show them with pepperball guns. No evidence that any actual live ammunition has been fired, though the cops have made spurious claims of the protesters shooting that are not backed up by any other evidence. A limited amount of looting and burning was done on the first night of the protests, and has not been repeated. Despite claims by the police of over a dozen cop cars being destroyed by rioters, there is likewise no evidence.

* The Huffington Post and Washington Post had reporters in a local McDonalds filming the action. The county police (the riot cop/SWAT guys) burst in to kick everyone out, then arrested the reporters for not moving fast enough. The St. Louis chief of police was called and had no idea this was going on. Apparently the riot cops were essentially acting with no higher authority to control them and were basically allowed to roam free and act out their wannabe soldier power trips.

* Al-Jazeera's reporters were shot with rubber buckshot and had a tear gas canister fired at them despite very obviously being the press (they had cameras and lights on tripods set up). The police came after driving them off and dismantled their gear. They later attempted to claim that the reporters were shot at by accident and the police hustled them into an APC for their safety and were just taking down their gear to help pack up. The reporters have called bullshit on them.

* This afternoon, the governor officially pulled the county police out and had them replaced with the state police, led by Capt. Johnson (a black man who grew up in the neighborhood), which included many black cops. Shockingly enough, treating the protesters like human beings and allowing them to peacefully address their grievances calmed everything down immediately.

* The protesters marched peacefully for the rest of the day and night, accompanied by regular uniformed police with no riot gear. Someone in the crowd was injured by a vehicle or fell ill and a police SUV took her to the hospital, with the New Black Panthers acting as impromptu traffic police. The St. Louis police chief arrived to meet with the protesters and take selfies (http://i.imgur.com/SGdaC6h.jpg).

* NYC and St. Louis held their own protests. The NYPD temporarily corralled the protesters and 4 people were arrested (including Jason Woody, one of the big Occupy protesters), but the rest were allowed to exit the area. A live streamer filming it attempted to stir up the crowd by screaming that the cops would arrest thousands, but everyone in the crowd told him to shut the fuck up.

tl;dr: County Police are the evil monsters we need protection from.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 15, 2014, 07:54:31 pm
It has been confirmed by the chief of police that Wilson did not know that Brown was a robbery suspect when he confronted him. Brown and his friend were apparently walking in the middle of the road and the officer was shouting at them to get on the sidewalk. The exact events that resulted in the eventual altercation are still not factually known.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: m52nickerson on August 15, 2014, 09:16:48 pm
The exact events that resulted in the eventual altercation are still not factually known.

Facts?  Who needs facts?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on August 15, 2014, 09:54:46 pm
Yeah when the chief of police who apparently headed a department that charged a man with bleeding on uniforms after they got through beating the crap out of him can just release whatever smear campaign he wants on a dead black kid who gives a shit about facts?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: m52nickerson on August 16, 2014, 12:10:09 am
Well except for the fact they literally have video of Brown robbing the store and roughing up the clerk. 
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 16, 2014, 12:19:24 am
Well except for the fact they literally have video of Brown robbing the store and roughing up the clerk. 

While true, the relevance this has on the case of the murder is non-existent.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 16, 2014, 12:44:20 am
Unless Brown was armed and was about to open fire it's not relevant.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 16, 2014, 12:54:25 am
Unless Brown was armed and was about to open fire it's not relevant.

Correct. It's been confirmed that Brown was not stopped by Officer Wilson as a robbery suspect. In fact, Wilson had no clue that he was supposed to suspect Brown at all. The robbery has zero bearing on the shooting and entirely serves as a smear campaign, attempting to pain Brown as a vicious thug that had to be put down before he hurt somebody.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on August 16, 2014, 12:55:02 am
Well except for the fact they literally have video of Brown robbing the store and roughing up the clerk. 

Yeah bout that.  One ittle bitty question I have to ask.

(https://33.media.tumblr.com/6c9f86aacf2684e95bfab408a9ba1040/tumblr_nad7ydphcH1sgdch8o1_500.png)

Ironbite-how'd Mike Brown change his clothing and go 3/4th a mile just to get shot 6 minutes after the alleged robbery?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 16, 2014, 01:03:05 am
It's been confirmed that the robbery took place at a bodega rather than the Quick Stop that was burned down on Saturday. However, the proposed route is only 0.6 miles between those locations and can pretty quickly be covered in 10 minutes or less. Also, it's really obviously Brown who robbed the store. He's wearing the exact same clothing, has the same build, and his buddy/witness has admitted that Brown was the robber.

Brown robbed a store of $50 worth of cigars. That's a fact. It has no bearing on the shooting except as an attempt to smear him as essentially a rabid dog who needed to be put down, but it's still a fact.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 16, 2014, 12:10:11 pm
So we saw a repeat of the earlier incidents last night. The Something Awful guys were giving live updates (both checking Twitter and Instagram and talking to a guy who was there), so I can compile some info:

* The protesters were holding peaceful protests/block parties last night in parking lots and yards.

* County PD sent in the riot cops again to try and break it up. They did the exact same bang-up job as before: firing tear gas to break up groups and aiming rifles at unarmed protesters and individuals filming them.

* A few dozen looters and taggers took advantage of the chaos to do their thing. The protesters (including some New Black Panthers) and store owners got together, some with guns, and defended the stores from the looters. Meanwhile the media is trying to paint it as a riot.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 16, 2014, 01:42:46 pm
SPOOO-OOOKKY BLACK POEPLE OOOGABOOGABOOGA!
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 16, 2014, 05:21:20 pm
The governor has declared a state of emergency and a midnight to 5:00 AM curfew in Ferguson. No word on whether or not he admitted that any chaos has been directly caused by the riot police that keep showing up and firing tear gas at peaceful protesters and aiming AR-15s at unarmed bystanders, providing chaos for looters and vandals to take advantage of.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on August 16, 2014, 05:30:19 pm
If there's one good thing that comes from this, it might be that the local police will be reformed.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Second Coming of Madman on August 16, 2014, 06:43:00 pm
Jackboots, that's all these policemen are. In fact, I could have sworn I saw something like this in a game...what was it again?

(click to show/hide)

That's right, the police in Ferguson have officially become the Orwellian Civil Protection. With this curfew and "state of emergency" , I expect far more abuses.

After all, "Outside agitators" are coming right to here Ferguson and we can't have nun of that, can we now? Can we? After all, the cops are only doing their best to quell those protesting from throwing der deadly munitions of bottles at them! And those them there journalists are doing their best to create unrest in our cer-munities. /s
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 16, 2014, 07:02:27 pm
I HOPE that the local and county police get what should be coming to them, but I doubt it. At the very least, the FBI has launched their own investigation and I think it's far more likely to get justice from them than from the county police because, yes, it's SO relevant to know that Brown was a suspect in a robbery that the shooter was unaware of!
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Second Coming of Madman on August 16, 2014, 07:15:33 pm
I HOPE that the local and county police get what should be coming to them, but I doubt it. At the very least, the FBI has launched their own investigation and I think it's far more likely to get justice from them than from the county police because, yes, it's SO relevant to know that Brown was a suspect in a robbery that the shooter was unaware of!

Ah, yes. Apparently one can change their clothes in a instant.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 16, 2014, 07:38:04 pm
I HOPE that the local and county police get what should be coming to them, but I doubt it. At the very least, the FBI has launched their own investigation and I think it's far more likely to get justice from them than from the county police because, yes, it's SO relevant to know that Brown was a suspect in a robbery that the shooter was unaware of!

Ah, yes. Apparently one can change their clothes in a instant.

I don't get where this "change clothes" thing comes from. The suspect in the video and Brown's body are visibly wearing the same outfit right down to the gaudy socks/sandals combo. The red hat is visible in other crime scene photos as well.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 16, 2014, 08:00:30 pm
#Invalid YouTube Link#

One week and it's already being called a hoax.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: TheUnknown on August 16, 2014, 08:12:51 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWwkEbYIl_0

One week and it's already being called a hoax.

Fixed link.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 16, 2014, 08:18:58 pm
Much appreciated.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on August 16, 2014, 09:03:28 pm
I HOPE that the local and county police get what should be coming to them, but I doubt it. At the very least, the FBI has launched their own investigation and I think it's far more likely to get justice from them than from the county police because, yes, it's SO relevant to know that Brown was a suspect in a robbery that the shooter was unaware of!

Ah, yes. Apparently one can change their clothes in a instant.

I don't get where this "change clothes" thing comes from. The suspect in the video and Brown's body are visibly wearing the same outfit right down to the gaudy socks/sandals combo. The red hat is visible in other crime scene photos as well.

Person in the video is actually wearing sneakers.  Brown is wearing that socks/sandals combo that should've lead to a beatdown by someone.  Terrible choice.

Best way to quell this is to let the curfew go for a day or two, then fire the police chief.  Asshole should've never been sent out in that first press conference where he released the store security footage.  The FBI and DoJ told him not to do it and he did it anyway.  Fire his ass and right there you'll be on the way to solving half your problems.

Ironbite-other half is to charge the cop with murder and convict his ass.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 16, 2014, 10:05:02 pm
http://www.politico.com/story/2014/08/ferguson-reporters-media-110080.html?hp=l1

Oh look, an article that says that the media was being threatened by the looters... that the article claims were the demonstrators. Huh, it's almost as if people BREAKING THE FUCKING LAW don't want to be photographed! Not to mention that, no, the looters were probably not protesters. It's almost as if assholes will take advantage of the chaos to get away with crime!

EDIT: Also, the comments are EXACTLY what I expect the right-wing reaction would be. Every single one of them is trusting the police report at face value, despite the fact that the police report took zero eyewitness accounts into consideration and that ALL eyewitness accounts contradict the police report.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 16, 2014, 10:15:20 pm
Person in the video is actually wearing sneakers.  Brown is wearing that socks/sandals combo that should've lead to a beatdown by someone.  Terrible choice.

(http://www.trbimg.com/img-53ee28af/turbine/la-na-brown-surveillance-20140815/525/484x525)

Really obviously socks with sandals.

His friend has admitted that he and Brown were in the store that day and some sources say that he admitted that Brown is the thief. The suspect in the video is wearing the exact same clothes right down to the hat and shoes and has the same build as the corpse on the street. It takes a hell of a denial to not think it was him.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 16, 2014, 10:22:00 pm
You guys do realize that by arguing this, you're just derailing the conversation, which was likely the POINT of releasing the robbery video in the first place, right?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 16, 2014, 10:28:51 pm
You guys do realize that by arguing this, you're just derailing the conversation, which was likely the POINT of releasing the robbery video in the first place, right?

It's not an argument. The fact that Brown is the guy in the video is a fact. It has no bearing on whether or not it was legal to shoot him while he was unarmed, but it's ridiculous to assert that it must have been someone else when all evidence says the contrary and I'm going to point out when someone is wrong about it.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: m52nickerson on August 17, 2014, 12:45:47 am
Well except for the fact they literally have video of Brown robbing the store and roughing up the clerk. 

While true, the relevance this has on the case of the murder is non-existent.

How do you know it was a murder?  Thing is you, and just about everyone else on the planet don't.  The cop may in fact be guilty, or he may have been assaulted and opened fire.

It's not an argument. The fact that Brown is the guy in the video is a fact. It has no bearing on whether or not it was legal to shoot him while he was unarmed, but it's ridiculous to assert that it must have been someone else when all evidence says the contrary and I'm going to point out when someone is wrong about it.

You don't have to be armed to be a threat to a police officers life, or anyone elses.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 17, 2014, 12:53:43 am
You don't have to be armed to be a threat to a police officers life, or anyone elses.

No, but you have to also be a threat. Witness reports and crime scene photos suggest that Brown was shot while running and then killed while 35 feet away from the cop and surrendering.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 17, 2014, 03:04:32 am
So I decided to watch the live streams of the protest tonight. Apparently a black communist revolutionary group from Chicago showed up to instigate more protests in violation of the midnight to 5:00 AM curfew. The official media pen was behind the cops, conveniently preventing an accurate view of the action from the protesters' side, and they were threatened with arrest if they tried to leave it (a Something Awful member was in the area and provided us with live updates). However, Vice News had one of their men live streaming from the protesters' side.

It was basically a more subdued version of the first nights. Protesters got within about 50 yards before tear gas was fired (police and CNN claimed that they were smoke grenades, but 37mm CS canisters have been recovered by protesters and bystanders and a city police officer said that he thought it was tear gas as well), and it took 10 or 20 minutes to disperse them. The cops pushed the protesters back and scattered them, but began raiding a nearby strip mall for little apparent reason. One cop was visible aiming an AR-15 at random people with his weapon light on for over 5 minutes, standing on the roof on an armored car. They also busted out the LRAD, which is fucking painful even through my computer speakers.

There have been some arrests. Pearl Gabel said on Twitter that the cops arrested her at gunpoint, only to release her after a few minutes. The co-founder of Twitter has been arrested as well. We also have reports that two protesters were shot, one in the leg and one in the neck. No word on who shot them, but what appear to be .40 S&W casings have been found and photographed by bystanders. I also distinctly heard what was unmistakably semi-auto rifle fire during the first push back.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 17, 2014, 08:29:47 am
Well except for the fact they literally have video of Brown robbing the store and roughing up the clerk. 

While true, the relevance this has on the case of the murder is non-existent.

How do you know it was a murder?  Thing is you, and just about everyone else on the planet don't.  The cop may in fact be guilty, or he may have been assaulted and opened fire.

It's not an argument. The fact that Brown is the guy in the video is a fact. It has no bearing on whether or not it was legal to shoot him while he was unarmed, but it's ridiculous to assert that it must have been someone else when all evidence says the contrary and I'm going to point out when someone is wrong about it.

You don't have to be armed to be a threat to a police officers life, or anyone elses.

Even in the best possible version of the story for him, Wilson is still in the wrong and is guilty of some form of murder. In order to use deadly force, an officer must be able to prove that he was in danger for the entire altercation. Last I checked, the suspect standing 35 feet away with his hands up is not a threat to his life. Had Brown rushed him after turning around, deadly force would have been more likely to be justified.

Furthermore, Wilson also broke standard police procedure in several ways. He did not report in the shooting. The Ferguson police had no idea that an officer was involved in the shooting, even when he did say there was a shooting. He did not call for backup, which, if I remember correctly, is standard procedure when shots are fired. He did not call for medical assistance. Eyewitness accounts allege that he didn't even try to check if Brown was still breathing and he refused to let a nurse who showed up on the scene attempt to perform CPR.

So, we have a police report that is contradicted by every eyewitness and audio from police dispatch that shows that Wilson did not handle the events within proper procedure. If that isn't suspicious, nothing is.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 17, 2014, 09:04:41 am
I hate to sound naive, but don't cops have tazers and/or pepper spray and/or a baton for dealing with criminals in a non-lethal way?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on August 17, 2014, 10:17:57 am
I hate to sound naive, but don't cops have tazers and/or pepper spray and/or a baton for dealing with criminals in a non-lethal way?

... And beanbag shotgun shells, LRAD, pepperballs...

(I almost misspelled shotgun as "shitgun", but autocorrect caught it.)
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 17, 2014, 10:37:46 am
I hate to sound naive, but don't cops have tazers and/or pepper spray and/or a baton for dealing with criminals in a non-lethal way?

... And beanbag shotgun shells, LRAD, pepperballs...

(I almost misspelled shotgun as "shitgun", but autocorrect caught it.)
I meant that even if the kid was charging at him he should have been able to deal with him via tazer or something.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 17, 2014, 12:26:42 pm
I hate to sound naive, but don't cops have tazers and/or pepper spray and/or a baton for dealing with criminals in a non-lethal way?

... And beanbag shotgun shells, LRAD, pepperballs...

(I almost misspelled shotgun as "shitgun", but autocorrect caught it.)
I meant that even if the kid was charging at him he should have been able to deal with him via tazer or something.

They do. Not all officers carry all less-lethal options, but it's highly doubtful that Wilson had nothing but a handgun to subdue criminals.

Also, the ongoing claim is that Brown attempted to grab Wilson's gun and that escalated the situation to require deadly force. Never mind the improbability of this claim (Wilson was sitting in his car when it occurred, which would have required Brown to reach around Wilson's body to try and yank it out of a retention holster that likely would not give up the gun at all to him), the situation would have deescalated as soon as Brown was no longer attempting to gain control of the gun. There's no legal justification for shooting him purely for grabbing at the gun unless he's in the process of taking it when shot.

Of course, we live in a world where "the ground under your feet" and "the curb" are classified as deadly weapons and someone punching you in the face is now cause for deadly force.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: m52nickerson on August 17, 2014, 12:54:12 pm
The report from the police are that Brown and the officer were struggling in the car when the first shot took place, the officer than continued to fire as Brown fled.  The whole incident probably took only a few seconds, if it did play out as the police said.  In that case the officer is not going to be guilty of any wrongdoing.  Brown being 35 feet away is not going to matter.  Police are trained that once they decide to use dealy force to continue until the threat is neutralized.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 17, 2014, 01:28:30 pm
The report from the police are that Brown and the officer were struggling in the car when the first shot took place, the officer than continued to fire as Brown fled.  The whole incident probably took only a few seconds, if it did play out as the police said.  In that case the officer is not going to be guilty of any wrongdoing.  Brown being 35 feet away is not going to matter.  Police are trained that once they decide to use dealy force to continue until the threat is neutralized.

No, police are trained to use deadly force against someone who is a threat that requires deadly force. As soon as the situation deescalates, they must stop attempting to kill the target. If someone is holding a knife and you shoot them and they drop the knife after being shot, you can no longer shoot them.

As soon as the unarmed Brown fled, he was no longer a threat that required deadly force and nothing will make shooting him legal except the ridiculous corruption in our legal system.

This is the same police department (http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/08/15/the-day-ferguson-cops-were-caught-in-a-bloody-lie.html) that arrested the wrong man, held him in a one-person cell with another inmate, beat him until he had a concussion and charged him with property destruction for bleeding on their uniforms, then let him go.

This is the same country in which a federal court dismissed the charges against the officers despite them perjuring themselves on the stand, as it determined that the perjury and injuries were "too minor" to bother dealing with.

In short, ha ha fuck your statement. Cops can easily get away with illegal actions as long as the courts keep letting them get away with it and apologists keep trying to excuse their behavior. Police officers are the only people in the world who can shoot an unarmed person while they're fleeing or surrendering and they get people trying to excuse their behavior instead of prosecuting them.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Witchyjoshy on August 17, 2014, 01:45:22 pm
Not to mention that Brown and the police officer were struggling in the first place because the police officer attempted to drag him into the car.

It was the police officer who initiated conflict in the first place.  All because a couple of black people were walking down the middle of the street.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: m52nickerson on August 17, 2014, 01:54:33 pm
Not to mention that Brown and the police officer were struggling in the first place because the police officer attempted to drag him into the car.

It was the police officer who initiated conflict in the first place.  All because a couple of black people were walking down the middle of the street.

That is one of the other things that does not make sense.  Unless you are competing in a Brazilian Jiu Jitsu you don't try and pull someone on top of you.   
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Witchyjoshy on August 17, 2014, 02:32:22 pm
Not to mention that Brown and the police officer were struggling in the first place because the police officer attempted to drag him into the car.

It was the police officer who initiated conflict in the first place.  All because a couple of black people were walking down the middle of the street.

That is one of the other things that does not make sense.  Unless you are competing in a Brazilian Jiu Jitsu you don't try and pull someone on top of you.   

You're assuming the policeman acted with logic instead of emotion.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 17, 2014, 03:40:09 pm
The report from the police are that Brown and the officer were struggling in the car when the first shot took place, the officer than continued to fire as Brown fled.  The whole incident probably took only a few seconds, if it did play out as the police said.  In that case the officer is not going to be guilty of any wrongdoing.  Brown being 35 feet away is not going to matter.  Police are trained that once they decide to use dealy force to continue until the threat is neutralized.
That's the military you're thinking of.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Art Vandelay on August 17, 2014, 08:18:01 pm
The report from the police are that Brown and the officer were struggling in the car when the first shot took place, the officer than continued to fire as Brown fled.  The whole incident probably took only a few seconds, if it did play out as the police said.  In that case the officer is not going to be guilty of any wrongdoing.  Brown being 35 feet away is not going to matter.  Police are trained that once they decide to use dealy force to continue until the threat is neutralized.
That's the military your thinking of.
What about his thinking of?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: davedan on August 17, 2014, 08:18:59 pm
That's the thing that struck me too...whatever version he either was shot while running away (no threat) or  surrendering with his hands up (no threat).

Regardless of the intervening events it sounds like murder/manslaughter to me. Also incredibly bad policing to fire randomly after a fleeing suspect. The police should be banned from watching Holywood cop movies.

Although this reminds me of the Naked Gun movie I saw on TV last night where Lelsie Nielsen says: "To think the next time I shoot a man I could be charged with murder!"
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Damen on August 17, 2014, 10:43:28 pm
Frankly, with this cops, at this point I wouldn't believe them if they told me rain was wet.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on August 17, 2014, 11:09:15 pm
Reports are trickling in that the cops are using tear gas and sonic weapons on people walking around town.  2 HOURS BEFORE CURFEW IS SUPPOSED TO START!

Ironbite-when do we burn this place to the ground?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Tolpuddle Martyr on August 17, 2014, 11:52:47 pm
For those with a little faith in humanity left, sorry I have to squelch some of it.

The Klan is doing a fundraising drive for the policeman who shot Michael Brown (http://www.splcenter.org/blog/2014/08/13/kkk-raising-money-for-police-officer-who-shot-african-american-teen/).
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on August 17, 2014, 11:54:46 pm
And you know what type of cops showed up to this one?

BIKE COPS!

Ironbite-AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!  *supernovas*
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 18, 2014, 12:11:54 am
I am literally shaking with rage with what's going on right now.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Sigmaleph on August 18, 2014, 12:49:09 am
For those with a little faith in humanity left, sorry I have to squelch some of it.

The Klan is doing a fundraising drive for the policeman who shot Michael Brown (http://www.splcenter.org/blog/2014/08/13/kkk-raising-money-for-police-officer-who-shot-african-american-teen/).

Well, at the very least that might make some people take a look and wonder if they really want to be on the same side of the issue as the KKK.

I don't believe in judging a side by its worst adherents, but other people certainly do
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Tolpuddle Martyr on August 18, 2014, 01:01:54 am
Sigma, given the toxic blend of belligerence and incompetence thus far demonstrated by the Ferguson Police Department I wouldn't hold out much hope for that!
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Witchyjoshy on August 18, 2014, 01:17:41 am
Frankly, with this cops, at this point I wouldn't believe them if they told me rain was wet.

This reminds me of a quote from Mass Effect's own dear Wrex.

"Don't piss in my ear and tell me it's raining!"

Oh, also.

White men in white robes with white hoods have said
"This man is splendid, a black man is dead."
Their praise is taken just as well
As if Satan gave his own blessings from hell!
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 18, 2014, 01:27:13 am
So, tonight, we have more journalists being threatened, including a video where a cop literally yells a threat to shoot a cameraman, alleged gunshots (that were allegedly confirmed to be fireworks), causing the police to start throwing tear gas into the protesters, an APC was allegedly driven into the protesters, a woman told a livestreamer that she was shot with a rubber bullet and was refused medical attention, protesters break into the McDonalds, but not to loot, but to retrieve milk to assist a woman hit by tear gas, the tear gas also hit the press and an 8-year-old, allegedly confirmed gunshots, a stand-off between the police and another group of people, allegedly protesters, near the crime scene (later allegedly confirmed to NOT be protesters), alleged looting of the Wal-Greens and Papa Johns, an AP reporter said within earshot of a livestream that police were shooting tear gas AT him intentionally. Allegedly, there was shoot-out between the police and five suspects, one of whom was allegedly killed.

Yeah, the right-wingers and the racists are going to have a goddamn field day tomorrow. Fucking hell.

EDIT: https://new.livestream.com/accounts/9035483/events/3271930 here's the livestream of the cameraman who was threatened. There's apparently going to be a press conference in a few minutes.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Svata on August 18, 2014, 01:30:24 am
Mondays (technically) on the local Fox station they do reruns of Burn Notice at 12:30 AM. Before that there is a show called "The Georgia Gang" which is a political show, and one of the guys came out ij supprt of the Furgeson Police.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 18, 2014, 01:40:43 am
The police have apparently confirmed that, no the shooters and looters are NOT with the protesters. Anyone with half a brain could tell you that. Hopefully it will quell some of the idiocy tomorrow, but I doubt it.

EDIT: There is allegedly footage that confirms that police claims of molotovs being thrown at the police is a lie. I hope this footage is released soon.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Tolpuddle Martyr on August 18, 2014, 02:06:08 am
Just checked out the Guardian website on Michael Brown's autopsy (http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/18/ferguson-michael-brown-shot-multiple-times-autopsy-shows-including-in-head).

The line being used by apologists of the local police is that because Brown was involved in robbing cigars and because the police incident report of the shooting claimed he was trying to rush the officer it's all good.

Nuance isn't these people's thing, one - the video of the store robbery only allegedly shows Michael Brown and friend-not even the bungling local police chief claims that it is Michael Brown robbing the store. Two, Robbing a store is not-as far as I understand it, a capital offense in Missouri and three the police incident report was withheld for days by the county police and released mysteriously to coincide with a video of a completely unrelated incident that they have already established was unknown to Brown's shooter. Three-there is no evidence that Brown was trying to rush the police officer who shot him, only that he was "leaning forward".

But-according to some people if there is even a rumor that a black guy was involved in something bad that justifies shooting them!

Can evidence police have of a crime being investigated even be used in court if it's released to the press prior to the matter going to trial?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 18, 2014, 02:19:34 am
Press conference going on right now: tear gas was allegedly used on protesters in response to shootings and molotovs.

EDIT: Captain Johnson does not blame peaceful protesters. He claims the agitators were organized. He did not say what lead him to this conclusion.

Apparently at least 3 people were injured, no officers were injured.

Arrest count: As of 1:21am, seven or eight.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Tolpuddle Martyr on August 18, 2014, 03:19:26 am
Video showing man alleged to be Brown by police chief paying for his goods (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=maA1FUJqhew).

Final nail in the coffin for police chiefs excuses?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 18, 2014, 12:12:58 pm
Okay, so I was watching the live streams from Vice last night. It's what kept me from getting enough sleep.

I'll repost from a post I made on Tumblr here to explain what you guys missed by just watching the folk in the media pen.

* Alice Speri and Claire Ward had a local guide them into Ferguson shortly before curfew. They filmed the SWAT cops deploying in the curfew zone, then approached them and talked their way out of arrest.

* They filmed the entire 20+ minute walk/ride to the media staging area, grilling the cops the whole way to try and get them to talk. It became apparent that the police have been ordered not to talk to any media about the incident.

* While in the media area, they realized that there was no way to actually film anything because the cops specifically posted the journalists too far from the action to document anything. So they sneak the fuck out.

* While filming a guy getting strip searched, two cops come up and try to corral them back to the staging area. They play dumb and bullshit the cops right to their faces that they’re “going to leave.”

* Instead of going to their car, they run to the police area and film a private prison bus being used as a paddy wagon (http://giant.gfycat.com/BountifulUnripeBarnowl.gif) and get statements from the prisoners.

* The cop claims that command is ordering them back to the staging area and demands that they stop filming. The girls refuse and he can’t stop them because he knows that it would be illegal.

Last I saw them they were trying to drive around and film more, but it looks like the police actually radioed to the rest of the units about these girls to stop them.

The press conference Captain Johnson gave was lie after lie. Everyone watching the live streamed footage of the protests can testify that not a single Molotov was thrown, nor was the crowd as violent as the cops have suggested. The National Guard has been called in.

I'm on Something Awful every night this is happening, watching streams and getting live updates from guys there. Don't believe what the media tells you after the fact. So much of what they're saying about "coordinated attacks" and "violent protests" is patently wrong.

The Brown autopsy (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/18/us/michael-brown-autopsy-shows-he-was-shot-at-least-6-times.html?smid=tw-bna&_r=0) shows that the bullets that didn't hit him in the head (once in the top of the skull, believed to be the fatal shot) hit the undersides of his arms. If you put his arms up next to his head, you'll see that the grouping is entirely consistent with someone with his hands up being shot by a guy aiming for his head.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on August 18, 2014, 12:32:13 pm
Wow...brave of them to leave the media area.  But still stupid to put themselves in danger.

Ironbite-this whole situation is just insane.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 18, 2014, 12:39:26 pm
Alex Jones is trying to claim that the New Black Panthers and Nation of Islam showed up to "foment violence."

People who are actually there are saying that the two groups were actually trying to get the protesters to peacefully disperse before curfew to avoid another less-lethal slaughter. They aren't here to protest the cops being dicks. They want to see Darren Wilson indicted and/or arrested. There are two narratives going on: the majority of the protesters want justice for Mike Brown, and a minority are staying after curfew and challenging the cops to fight them (bro). But the media just tries to paint it as a bunch of violent protesters rioting in the streets.

I've legit come as close to seeing the action with my own eyes as I can without physically being in Ferguson getting tear gassed. The media is as wrong as they can be.

Edit: By the way, here's a journalist being threatened with getting shot for filming the riots. He live streamed it to 40,000 people when it happened.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=razYgZ0P1KY
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Askold on August 18, 2014, 12:45:17 pm
Wow...brave of them to leave the media area.  But still stupid to put themselves in danger.

Ironbite-this whole situation is just insane.

...Danger...

In a civilized country, the press going against the orders of police might have them end up detained and having their eguipment confiscated for a while if they go someplace they aren't supposed to go. They might even end up arrested charged with a crime but that would probably be for "resisting police orders" or something which gets them a slap on the wrists.

But "danger" is not something I excpect from a civilized country. There are certainly many countries where members of press can expect being jailed with made up charges or even "disappearing" or dying to "random gang related violence," but this is not something that is supposed to happen in a civilized country. (I'm looking at you Russia and China.)
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 18, 2014, 12:52:21 pm
There was basically no danger to the girls from anyone except the police. The protesters are not as violent as the media claims; in fact, the girls are treated as the good guys by the citizens because they're filming the stuff that's going on like the paddy wagon from a private prison. A local family even offered to let them stay in their house for protection.

I watched all of their interactions with the people they've met. The protesters are willing to talk for hours about everything because they know that the girls are live streaming to the internet and everything they say will be uploaded uncensored and unfiltered, while CNN patiently waits in the media pen too far from the action to see anything but cops in front of a cloud of tear gas while reporting on apocryphal reports of Molotovs and protesters shooting that they can't even see for themselves.

Meanwhile, the cops attempt to detain, arrest, and assault journalists even when they're in unrestricted areas before curfew and illegally try to force them to stop filming things like the prison bus and strip search because they don't want those images reaching the public. The curfew makes it even worse, as there's almost nobody on the streets except the police who are going to arrest them and probably damage/destroy their equipment.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 18, 2014, 12:52:45 pm
Brown allegedly had marijuana in his system. Yup, racists and right-wingers are going to have a fucking field day today.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 18, 2014, 12:55:31 pm
You may have seen claims of people "looting" McDonalds. That's not what they did.

https://twitter.com/Remorse_1/status/501326930302746627/photo/1
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 18, 2014, 02:27:32 pm
Well, CNN has confirmed that the convenience store that Brown allegedly robbed never actually filed a report about a robbery.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Witchyjoshy on August 18, 2014, 03:43:01 pm
I find it consistent with what I know about the USA that lots of white people who have never had to be racially profiled are thinking the police are doing a bang-up job.

Paint a black person as a thief and suddenly, everything is justifiable.

I hate this racist country.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on August 18, 2014, 03:47:08 pm
I find it consistent with what I know about the USA that lots of white people who have never had to be racially profiled are thinking the police are doing a bang-up job.

Paint a black person as a thief and suddenly, everything is justifiable.

I hate this racist country.
Most Americans aren't racist.  And things are a lot better here than in, say, Italy.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 18, 2014, 03:48:47 pm
Seriously, watch the live streams tonight and compare them to how the mass media reports it. It's the best way to realize just how full of shit the current CNN/MSNBC/Fox narrative is.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on August 18, 2014, 03:50:50 pm
Seriously, watch the live streams tonight and compare them to how the mass media reports it. It's the best way to realize just how full of shit the current CNN/MSNBC/Fox narrative is.
I swear, it's like they're operating out of alternate universes or something.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 18, 2014, 03:56:33 pm
Apparently the cops are already trying to harangue journalists and protesters. They won't even let people stop walking.

I know it seems crazy for me to be all "Don't trust the media" like some kind of whacko conspiracy theorist, but I watched this shit happen with my own eyes, at least as close as I could without actually flying to Ferguson. What's happening on the ground through the completely uncensored streams doesn't match the narrative the cops and media are trying to push. The protests aren't violent. There's no riots. Molotovs aren't being thrown and protesters aren't shooting at the police. It's all lie after lie, and thousands of people are watching it happen.

In fact, the protesters have been trying to stop the violence. The vandals and looters are criminals taking advantage of the chaos, but the way the media makes it look the protest is a riot. It's all an attempt to justify to the public why they keep launching tear gas and firing rubber and wooden bullets at peaceful protesters and journalists.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 18, 2014, 04:35:07 pm
http://america.aljazeera.com/watch/shows/america-tonight/2014/8/a-tour-through-realferguson.html

At least Al Jazeera is doing what they can.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 18, 2014, 04:39:34 pm
Seriously, watch the live streams tonight and compare them to how the mass media reports it. It's the best way to realize just how full of shit the current CNN/MSNBC/Fox narrative is.
MSNBC?
I'm not surprised that Fox or "Prmising Younge Men" CNN are trying to push "teh spookeh negros" BS on us, but MSNBC is generally a fairly non-bulshitty Newssource.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on August 18, 2014, 04:42:11 pm
Seriously, watch the live streams tonight and compare them to how the mass media reports it. It's the best way to realize just how full of shit the current CNN/MSNBC/Fox narrative is.
MSNBC?
I'm not surprised that Fox or "Prmising Younge Men" CNN are trying to push "teh spookeh negros" BS on us, but MSNBC is generally a fairly non-bulshitty Newssource.
MSNBC is full of bullshit too.  But I'm surprised at the stance they're taking on this.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on August 18, 2014, 05:10:30 pm
Apparently the cops are already trying to harangue journalists and protesters. They won't even let people stop walking.

I know it seems crazy for me to be all "Don't trust the media" like some kind of whacko conspiracy theorist, but I watched this shit happen with my own eyes, at least as close as I could without actually flying to Ferguson. What's happening on the ground through the completely uncensored streams doesn't match the narrative the cops and media are trying to push. The protests aren't violent. There's no riots. Molotovs aren't being thrown and protesters aren't shooting at the police. It's all lie after lie, and thousands of people are watching it happen.

In fact, the protesters have been trying to stop the violence. The vandals and looters are criminals taking advantage of the chaos, but the way the media makes it look the protest is a riot. It's all an attempt to justify to the public why they keep launching tear gas and firing rubber and wooden bullets at peaceful protesters and journalists.

Got a link to the stream and when I should start watching for the shit going down?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 18, 2014, 05:14:30 pm
Apparently the cops are already trying to harangue journalists and protesters. They won't even let people stop walking.

I know it seems crazy for me to be all "Don't trust the media" like some kind of whacko conspiracy theorist, but I watched this shit happen with my own eyes, at least as close as I could without actually flying to Ferguson. What's happening on the ground through the completely uncensored streams doesn't match the narrative the cops and media are trying to push. The protests aren't violent. There's no riots. Molotovs aren't being thrown and protesters aren't shooting at the police. It's all lie after lie, and thousands of people are watching it happen.

In fact, the protesters have been trying to stop the violence. The vandals and looters are criminals taking advantage of the chaos, but the way the media makes it look the protest is a riot. It's all an attempt to justify to the public why they keep launching tear gas and firing rubber and wooden bullets at peaceful protesters and journalists.

Got a link to the stream and when I should start watching for the shit going down?

https://new.livestream.com/timcast

Tim Pool's the main Vice stream that I was watching. Last night that link provided both Tim's own stream and the two girls that did their Pulitzer-deserving sneaking.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Witchyjoshy on August 18, 2014, 07:27:20 pm
I find it consistent with what I know about the USA that lots of white people who have never had to be racially profiled are thinking the police are doing a bang-up job.

Paint a black person as a thief and suddenly, everything is justifiable.

I hate this racist country.
Most Americans aren't racist.  And things are a lot better here than in, say, Italy.

Most Americans are racist, they just don't know it or realize it.

You don't have to be a member of the KKK to be racist.

Most white people never have to deal with the kinda shit black people have to deal with when it comes to the police.  Of course, since they never experience it themselves, they think that there are other reasons for the police to pick on black people.

And when the police DO pick on someone who is white, repercussions are immediate.

Just to compare, a cop strangles a restrained white college student and everyone involved was almost instantly fired.

A cop chokes a black man to death and investigations are "still going."

A cop shoots a black teenager to death (I know 18 is technically an adult, but it's eighTEEN so fuck you) and he gets a significant part of America siding with him.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Eiki-mun on August 18, 2014, 07:45:52 pm
At this point, the only way the victims can get any fairness is if the entire Ferguson police force goes to jail for years.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on August 18, 2014, 08:12:23 pm
At this point, the only way the victims can get any fairness is if the entire Ferguson police force goes to jail for years.
I don't think it's that bad, but the Ferguson police is in serious need of reform.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Witchyjoshy on August 18, 2014, 08:43:15 pm
If a guy can get a life sentence for pirating, I don't see why the Ferguson police shouldn't spend years in jail for repeatedly assaulting a populace.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on August 18, 2014, 08:46:45 pm
If a guy can get a life sentence for pirating, I don't see why the Ferguson police shouldn't spend years in jail for repeatedly assaulting a populace.
I see your point.  But punishment must be restricted to the guilty, for both practical and moral reasons.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 18, 2014, 09:30:32 pm
Seriously, watch the live streams tonight and compare them to how the mass media reports it. It's the best way to realize just how full of shit the current CNN/MSNBC/Fox narrative is.
MSNBC?
I'm not surprised that Fox or "Prmising Younge Men" CNN are trying to push "teh spookeh negros" BS on us, but MSNBC is generally a fairly non-bulshitty Newssource.
MSNBC is full of bullshit too.  But I'm surprised at the stance they're taking on this.
I cling to the distant hope that outside the cults of Fox New's and CNN's cults most Americans will be able to see through the bullshit, doubtful though.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on August 18, 2014, 09:49:24 pm
Ok, so the news happened to be on TV and they we're showing a clip of the police arresting a guy during the "riot". They we're decked out in camo, carrying shotguns and rifles, wear body armor that looked a lot heavy than what you'd see a soldier wearing in Fallujah, and they wore helmets and gas masks which just perfectly completed their "dystopian cyberpunk soldier" look. I didn't get a good enough look at the guy they were arresting or what he was doing, but I suspect by their behavior it was nothing at all. Once they had the guy on the ground  the other guy circled around, le their rifles drop to their side on their slings, and drew their pistols with tactical lights and lasers. Why draw their pistols when they already have a perfectly fine rifle in their hands and hadn't fired a shot? I guess the wanted to show off their tactical quick draw. They of course proceeded to drag the guy away while the other officers covered them like soldiers pulling a wounded comrade to safety. Covering them from what? I don't know, invisible dragons I guess. Of course after this clip finished there were clips of multiple armored vehicle driving up in front of a crowd, with at least on having a guy standing in the top hatch with a gun aimed at the crowd.

Really? Really? When the guy whose gonna be trying to bid on a .50 cal rifle at auction in two weeks and sleeps with multiple knives nearby is telling you what you're doing is way to excessive, you should stop and listen. I mean seriously, it looks like the police from the second Hunger Games movie for anyone who's seen it.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 18, 2014, 10:03:15 pm
Needless to say, there's tons of conservative political cartoons about how "race-baiting" and how the protestors are degenerate nigger apes thugs.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: TheUnknown on August 18, 2014, 10:09:28 pm
Some tweets:

(click to show/hide)
Source (http://thewilsonblog.tumblr.com/post/95067337294/ferguson-from-my-tl)
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 18, 2014, 10:10:44 pm
Vice stream (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CmqHVKNZkhM).

It's quieter now, but if anyone pulls any shit it's going to get ugly.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Damen on August 18, 2014, 10:29:15 pm
I kinda want to go and buy up all the gas masks and filters I can and start handing them out to protestors.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 18, 2014, 10:31:16 pm
I kinda want to go and buy up all the gas masks and filters I can and start handing them out to protestors.
I would recommend wearing a mask that was darkened.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 18, 2014, 10:38:32 pm
The cops are arresting anyone who stands still for too long or walks too slowly when asked to move. They're trying to force an inability to congregate.

They arrested two guys on the Vice stream, though some have said that he threatened the cop first. The cops tried to keep the press from filming it.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on August 19, 2014, 12:37:56 am
The cops are arresting anyone who stands still for too long or walks too slowly when asked to move. They're trying to force an inability to congregate.

They arrested two guys on the Vice stream, though some have said that he threatened the cop first. The cops tried to keep the press from filming it.

I just started watching, and apparently they were pinned down by gunfire earlier. The police were firing live rounds at people. There are also unused shotgun shells and tear gas grenades lying around.

It's like a fucking warzone. Some of the reporters are wearing bulletproof vests and ballistic helmets. Ferguson seems to be intent on giving Gaza a run for it's money.'

The police are apparently doing a tactical sweep of houses.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on August 19, 2014, 01:19:13 am
Apparently the police are forcing people to move in one direction, but are blocking the other side as well, leaving them with no where to go.

The Vice reporter is said he sees smoke coming from a block away. I don't know if he means like smoke grenades, or a fire.

Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 19, 2014, 01:52:16 am
The cops are forcing everyone to the command center or homes. Anyone outside gets arrested even though there's no curfew. They just arrested a Fox reporter while he was live streaming them searching vehicles, but let him go a few minutes later. It's a scare tactic.

Cops are claiming the protesters threw bombs and frozen water bottles and that started it. Bull fucking shit. I watched it with my own eyes. One water bottle got thrown, someone fired a gun in the distance, and the cops immediately began firing on the protesters. Tim Pool from Vice got hit in the leg with a rubber round.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 19, 2014, 02:34:12 am
It's gone haywire.

The cops have dispersed the protest, but they're hunting people down. People are fleeing through the suburbs as police fire tear gas into yards. Two journalists got encircled in an apartment parking lot and were directly hit by tear gas canisters. They're arresting and shooting at everyone moving outside. The victims are live Tweeting. A reporter for The Intercept just got arrested.

Who fucking needs the Purge when you've got this?

Edit: (http://i.imgur.com/NKRmqxc.jpg)

The Crips and Bloods have joined forces to defend businesses.

This really is a work of fiction. This can't be real.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: TheUnknown on August 19, 2014, 03:05:42 am
When Ferguson's mayor said during a press conference that "this is a test, the eyes of the world are watching" (implying that the world is watching to make sure "the blacks" behave themselves"), my response was, "Yeah, the world is watching, and aside from white conservatives, they're not siding with you."
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 19, 2014, 03:12:33 am
It's gone haywire.

The cops have dispersed the protest, but they're hunting people down. People are fleeing through the suburbs as police fire tear gas into yards. Two journalists got encircled in an apartment parking lot and were directly hit by tear gas canisters. They're arresting and shooting at everyone moving outside. The victims are live Tweeting. A reporter for The Intercept just got arrested.

Who fucking needs the Purge when you've got this?

Edit: (http://i.imgur.com/NKRmqxc.jpg)

The Crips and Bloods have joined forces to defend businesses.

This really is a work of fiction. This can't be real.
Holy shit.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: SpaceProg on August 19, 2014, 03:27:14 am
This is reminding me more and more of the LA Riots. 

Is anyone here besides me old enough to remember that mess?

EDIT:  Old Viking is a given, I know.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 19, 2014, 03:40:50 am
This is reminding me more and more of the LA Riots. 
How?
With those the looting was a serious problem, here it's nothing.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Askold on August 19, 2014, 03:42:51 am
Well, I was alive during the LA Riots but I didn't really watch news much back then.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cerim Treascair on August 19, 2014, 05:15:52 am
I think if there's two rival gangs that hate the fuck out of each other and kill each other on sight ARE TEAMING UP AGAINST YOU, here's a hint:  You're in the wrong, Ferguson PD!
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: davedan on August 19, 2014, 05:46:22 am
John Oliver sums up the situation brilliantly:  #Invalid YouTube Link#
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: starseeker on August 19, 2014, 05:56:34 am
I just keep mentally comparing this to the London riots from 2011, which started similarly for similar reasons (black guy got shot by police, protests started), but didn't escalate. Because we didn't send in police with tanks, we just had a policeman on every corner or so. My sister's friends planned to go to the local town centre and loot/cause havoc, but got put off by all the police. That should be how to deal with this. Not something out of a dystopian novel. And American then has the gall to claim it's the land of the free.

[/rant]
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Sleepy on August 19, 2014, 06:38:36 am
This is like something out of a movie. I've never seen anything like it.

I'm also hearing reports of witnesses stating that Brown never robbed the original store they were in, that he paid for the cigars. But it's hard to confirm anything at this point.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 19, 2014, 06:57:35 am
This is like something out of a movie. I've never seen anything like it.

I'm also hearing reports of witnesses stating that Brown never robbed the original store they were in, that he paid for the cigars. But it's hard to confirm anything at this point.
Besides the fact the Ferguson police are cunts.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Art Vandelay on August 19, 2014, 07:07:10 am
I think if there's two rival gangs that hate the fuck out of each other and kill each other on sight ARE TEAMING UP AGAINST YOU, here's a hint:  You're in the wrong, Ferguson PD!
If those business get looted, then who are they going to shake down for protection money?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Dakota Bob on August 19, 2014, 07:31:15 am
John Oliver sums up the situation brilliantly:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwUZOZN-9dc

Fixed link for ya. and John Oliver is really doing fuckin' great on his new show.

EDIT: I think you meant to have this as your link
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KUdHIatS36A
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: RavynousHunter on August 19, 2014, 09:48:00 am
I think if there's two rival gangs that hate the fuck out of each other and kill each other on sight ARE TEAMING UP AGAINST YOU, here's a hint:  You're in the wrong, Ferguson PD!
If those business get looted, then who are they going to shake down for protection money?

That, and the number one rule of both gangs is never trust the police.  In a town like that, they've got good reason not to, which is disgusting.  Nothing like a common enemy to bring people together, eh?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 19, 2014, 05:25:51 pm
The police press report last night was another load of bullshit. They keep trying to fudge the timeline so it seems like the protesters are throwing shit and that incites the cops to use force. I watched it with my own eyes. It's always the police who escalate it; the protesters are totally peaceful until the riot cops start trying to force a dispersal or use the LRAD.

Captain Johnson even claimed that homemade bombs were being thrown. They weren't. Trust me, we would have seen it. The one building that got set on fire (ironically a barbecue restaurant) is believed to have been lit up by a burning tear gas canister.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Witchyjoshy on August 19, 2014, 05:28:29 pm
This is like something out of a movie. I've never seen anything like it.

I'm also hearing reports of witnesses stating that Brown never robbed the original store they were in, that he paid for the cigars. But it's hard to confirm anything at this point.

Well, the store's lawyer confirmed that they never filed a robbery report.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on August 19, 2014, 05:29:53 pm
The police press report last night was another load of bullshit. They keep trying to fudge the timeline so it seems like the protesters are throwing shit and that incites the cops to use force. I watched it with my own eyes. It's always the police who escalate it; the protesters are totally peaceful until the riot cops start trying to force a dispersal or use the LRAD.

Captain Johnson even claimed that homemade bombs were being thrown. They weren't. Trust me, we would have seen it. The one building that got set on fire (ironically a barbecue restaurant) is believed to have been lit up by a burning tear gas canister.
These morons are worse liars than Putin.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: starseeker on August 19, 2014, 05:54:40 pm
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-28855811

Oh god the irony of this.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 19, 2014, 06:22:29 pm
This is like something out of a movie. I've never seen anything like it.

I'm also hearing reports of witnesses stating that Brown never robbed the original store they were in, that he paid for the cigars. But it's hard to confirm anything at this point.

Well, the store's lawyer confirmed that they never filed a robbery report.

It was apparently a customer that filed the report and it was apparently AFTER the shooting. This means one of two things: 1, the police didn't care that it wasn't someone associated with the store that filed the report, which has seriously bad implications or 2, the police intentionally allowed the customer to file the report so they could use it against Brown, which has even worse implications.

We know there is a police report about a robbery, I've seen a picture of the report itself, but the fact that it wasn't filed by anyone associated with the store raises serious questions.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 19, 2014, 06:28:02 pm
Right now the best Ferguson police can say is they're just incompetent.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 19, 2014, 06:31:04 pm
Right now the best Ferguson police can say is they're just incompetent.

At best, incompetent, at worst, malicious. The sad thing is that I'm leaning towards thinking them to be malicious.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: davedan on August 19, 2014, 07:58:48 pm
John Oliver sums up the situation brilliantly:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwUZOZN-9dc

Fixed link for ya. and John Oliver is really doing fuckin' great on his new show.

EDIT: I think you meant to have this as your link
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KUdHIatS36A

Yeah sorry it was the second link I meant to add
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Damen on August 19, 2014, 08:05:36 pm
Remember when I said this?

(http://www.waystomakemoney101.com/files/hand_point_out_and_down.jpg)

Frankly, with this cops, at this point I wouldn't believe them if they told me rain was wet.

Aside from my grammatical errors, I have seen nothing out of these twats to make me feel like retracting or rethinking it.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on August 19, 2014, 11:14:54 pm
Vice has gone live for the sixth night in a row.

https://news.vice.com/article/ferguson-missouri-live
 (https://news.vice.com/article/ferguson-missouri-live)
They are currently making their way to the protest area and spotted a helicopter flying dark (no light on). Lovely sign.

Edit: To anyone else watching the stream, did you see the face on the "peace train"? Isn't that Yes Man from Fallout New Vegas?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Nemo on August 20, 2014, 12:04:36 am
My friend is the leader of an anti NDAA activist group, and he was down in Ferguson over the weekend. He noted on Facebook that the reports of rioters didn't match what he was seeing at all. I don't necessarily agree with all of his views (he believes FEMA camps exist), but I am glad to receive personal confirmation that the news aren't really giving us the full story.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on August 20, 2014, 12:59:54 am
Bottles are being thrown, and a phone was possibly stolen. Police are moving in to disperse the mostly peaceful crowd. I think shit's about to go down.

Edit: Shots fired, possibly live rounds. Someone was arrested. Media are being forced back to the media area.

A Crip tried starting a fight with a peace keeper I think.

Things were so calm until now.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on August 20, 2014, 01:26:39 am
The cops are trying to force all the media far away from the area. The are also surrounding the media group in the area and arresting people. I don't know if the people being arrested are media or protesters hiding among them. One guy near the vice guys said in the background "This is Orwellian as fuck".

One cop is yelling at anyone with a camera to turn it off or he'll through tear gas at them.

Tim has his respirator out and ready.

Edit: Ok, they have the rifles out and pointed at people.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 20, 2014, 01:29:22 am
Bottles are being thrown, and a phone was possibly stolen.


Honestly considering the police have spent the last several days aiming guns at people and throwing tear gas the protestors reaction is benign as fuck.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: niam2023 on August 20, 2014, 01:35:33 am
So, basically, the cops are threatening that if you do not fear them and their authority, then they will massacre everyone.

This is why I always picture police as malevolent / abusive / dirty.

They're acting like Sin City villains, the only thing missing is a yellow skinned freak and an evil senator or two.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Mechtaur on August 20, 2014, 01:38:30 am
Edit: Ok, they have the rifles out and pointed at people.

Jesus, I'm almost ready to believe that actual military control wouldn't be half as bad as this is getting.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 20, 2014, 02:02:07 am
They've apparently arrested a legal observer of the National Lawyers Guild.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on August 20, 2014, 02:04:18 am
A legal observer from the Lawyers guild was arrested, and another Legal observer confirmed it, and when asked why, the guy said, "because police don't like legal observers".

The team from Amnesty International left the area because it was getting too dangerous. This is the organization that sends human rights observer to some of the worst places on earth, and they're pulling out because it's too dangerous.

Edit: Ok, they have the rifles out and pointed at people.

Jesus, I'm almost ready to believe that actual military control wouldn't be half as bad as this is getting.

Yeah, I would hope the military at least has a little better training on the basics of gun safety and not pointing it at someone you don't intend to shoot.

Bottles are being thrown, and a phone was possibly stolen.


Honestly considering the police have spent the last several days aiming guns at people and throwing tear gas the protestors reaction is benign as fuck.

Yeah, I can think of a lot of worse ways to react to the actions of the police.

Edit: Cloud beat me to the legal observer part.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: niam2023 on August 20, 2014, 02:14:15 am
Whose leading the county police, kriffing Esdese or something?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: RavynousHunter on August 20, 2014, 12:58:19 pm
Whose leading the county police, kriffing Esdese or something?

Sounds like they're being led by Deathshead from fucking Wolfenstein.

Fuck the Guard, its time to send in the actual god damned Army.  Against the cops.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on August 20, 2014, 01:32:50 pm
There have apparently been over 120 arrests over the last week and a half. At least 14 of these arrests were of the press.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cerim Treascair on August 20, 2014, 11:15:30 pm
Doesn't that violate several amendments? First with Freedom of the Press and Fourth with Unreasonable Search and Seizure, at the very least?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Witchyjoshy on August 20, 2014, 11:21:45 pm
Doesn't that violate several amendments? First with Freedom of the Press and Fourth with Unreasonable Search and Seizure, at the very least?

Yep.

Too bad the far rightdingers don't give fucks about actual people's rights.  Just fake people's rights (fetuses, corporations, et al)
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on August 20, 2014, 11:22:45 pm
So apparently on KKK group is saying the KKK group raising money are fake and that the "real" KKK is staying out of Ferguson.

https://news.vice.com/article/a-ku-klux-klan-group-claims-it-is-around-ferguson-and-fundraising-for-darren-wilson (https://news.vice.com/article/a-ku-klux-klan-group-claims-it-is-around-ferguson-and-fundraising-for-darren-wilson)

You know, this shit just get's weirder and weirder. I know that "The Klan" no longer exists and it's just a bunch of small splinter groups now, but it's still weird. It's the Crips and Bloods joining up to defend the area, it's just so... bizarre to watch.

Anyway, I'm waiting for tonight's stream to start.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on August 20, 2014, 11:33:39 pm
Doesn't that violate several amendments? First with Freedom of the Press and Fourth with Unreasonable Search and Seizure, at the very least?

The police have been violating the Constitution and laws non-stop, but they have enough power that even trying to get a class action lawsuit filed would be extremely time and resource-consuming and likely result in a failure to get justice.

This is the same town where cops beat an innocent man, charged him with destruction of property for bleeding on their uniforms, perjured themselves right in a federal court when questioned, and had the federal court dismiss the case as it was determined that insufficient harm was done to constitute police brutality or violation of due process.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: RavynousHunter on August 21, 2014, 08:02:04 am
Just one of the reasons I'm actually somewhat serious about fixing the town's problems with federal and/or military force.  If force is the only thing they can understand, then its the only thing to which they'll respond.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: dpareja on August 22, 2014, 12:46:25 am
Ferguson right now:

(http://img-9gag-lol.9cache.com/photo/aoZZbpw_700b.jpg)
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 22, 2014, 01:05:30 am
Ever notice that when some douche like Elliot Rodgers goes on a killing spree the media will talk about how tragic they were, but now when a black guy dies the fact that he might have robbed a store is important?
 
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 26, 2014, 04:57:32 pm
You know, I'm wondering if they'll ever be any actual change over this?
Probably not.
The killer will get off scott free (with an sweet 200k to boot), the cops will maintain martial law for god knows how long, the media will portray this as "ignorant negroes gettin uppity",  and no laws will be passed to prevent this kind of thing from happening again.

Silly me, i though there was gonna be actual change!
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on August 26, 2014, 05:03:28 pm
You know, I'm wondering if they'll ever be any actual change over this?
Probably not.
The killer will get off scott free (with an sweet 200k to boot), the cops will maintain martial law for god knows how long, the media will portray this as "ignorant negroes gettin uppity",  and no laws will be passed to prevent this kind of thing from happening again.

Silly me, i though there was gonna be actual change!
Let's not throw in the towel just yet.  You can't expect change to happen overnight.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 26, 2014, 05:19:35 pm
You know, I'm wondering if they'll ever be any actual change over this?
Probably not.
The killer will get off scott free (with an sweet 200k to boot), the cops will maintain martial law for god knows how long, the media will portray this as "ignorant negroes gettin uppity",  and no laws will be passed to prevent this kind of thing from happening again.

Silly me, i though there was gonna be actual change!
Let's not throw in the towel just yet.  You can't expect change to happen overnight.
Okay, I suppose it's pretty impatient, but i just hope something changes.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: RavynousHunter on August 27, 2014, 10:28:50 am
Can't blame ya for bein impatient.  Watching all this shit happen time and time again, it'd be stranger if you weren't a little impatient.  But...well, baby steps and all that.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 27, 2014, 01:01:44 pm
Shit's not getting better either.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 28, 2014, 03:00:02 pm
Still not any better.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Witchyjoshy on August 28, 2014, 03:02:48 pm
For once, I share in your impatience.

The situation with Ferguson pisses me off for many reasons.

Have I mentioned proud racism is one of my berserk buttons?  Well that button's been jammed down.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 28, 2014, 03:44:06 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFQFB5YpDZE
John Stewart skews Fox News once again.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 28, 2014, 08:33:28 pm
http://blogs.riverfronttimes.com/dailyrft/2014/08/mya_aaten-white_shooting_victim_from_aug_12_says_police_have_not_interviewed_her.php (http://blogs.riverfronttimes.com/dailyrft/2014/08/mya_aaten-white_shooting_victim_from_aug_12_says_police_have_not_interviewed_her.php)

Woman was shot in head in Ferguson.
She's in OK condition currently.
Police report she was victim of a "Drive by shooting by 4-5 black males", but she reports that that's a load of bullshit.

Police confiscated the bullet in her head as evidence and have not conducted and interview with her.
Gee, I'd almost suspect this is a cover up.

http://littlegreenfootballs.com/article/43751_Jim_Hofts_Unsourced_Claim_That_Officer_Darren_Wilson_Had_an_Orbital_Blowout_Fracture_of_the_Eye_Socket (http://littlegreenfootballs.com/article/43751_Jim_Hofts_Unsourced_Claim_That_Officer_Darren_Wilson_Had_an_Orbital_Blowout_Fracture_of_the_Eye_Socket)
They also claim Wilson was assaulted and beaten.

http://www.christianpost.com/news/news-reporters-bombshell-ferguson-tweet-deemed-personal-revealed-to-be-on-leave-since-march-125348/ (http://www.christianpost.com/news/news-reporters-bombshell-ferguson-tweet-deemed-personal-revealed-to-be-on-leave-since-march-125348/)
Basically, the police are really unconvincing liars.



Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Askold on August 28, 2014, 11:47:14 pm

http://littlegreenfootballs.com/article/43751_Jim_Hofts_Unsourced_Claim_That_Officer_Darren_Wilson_Had_an_Orbital_Blowout_Fracture_of_the_Eye_Socket (http://littlegreenfootballs.com/article/43751_Jim_Hofts_Unsourced_Claim_That_Officer_Darren_Wilson_Had_an_Orbital_Blowout_Fracture_of_the_Eye_Socket)

They also claim Wilson was assaulted and beaten.


I think you should mention that according to that article the picture they published as proof of his injuries was fake. Because if they had simply SAID that he was injured we would have been forced to wait until there was evidence one way or other but instead they IMMEDIATELY published falsified evidence so we can go straigth to calling them liars.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 28, 2014, 11:50:03 pm

http://littlegreenfootballs.com/article/43751_Jim_Hofts_Unsourced_Claim_That_Officer_Darren_Wilson_Had_an_Orbital_Blowout_Fracture_of_the_Eye_Socket (http://littlegreenfootballs.com/article/43751_Jim_Hofts_Unsourced_Claim_That_Officer_Darren_Wilson_Had_an_Orbital_Blowout_Fracture_of_the_Eye_Socket)

They also claim Wilson was assaulted and beaten.




I think you should mention that according to that article the picture they published as proof of his injuries was fake. Because if they had simply SAID that he was injured we would have been forced to wait until there was evidence one way or other but instead they IMMEDIATELY published falsified evidence so we can go straigth to calling them liars.
Ah, I probably should have mentioned that aspect.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: RavynousHunter on August 29, 2014, 08:02:46 am
Honestly, I'm of the opinion that the Ferguson PD are all consummate liars.  Its literally a requirement to gain entry into their ranks.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on August 31, 2014, 05:37:43 pm
You know, I wonder when they'll finally be some kind of push-back against police brutality.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: niam2023 on August 31, 2014, 06:18:14 pm
Maybe we need someone to be brutal to police, to show them it doesn't feel good to be under someone's boot.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on September 01, 2014, 12:52:35 am
.....*pinches bridge of nose*

Ironbite-just...stop.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on September 01, 2014, 01:02:03 am
Any other suggestions?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Askold on September 01, 2014, 01:29:53 am
Civil protests and a political campaign for uprooting the corruption in the police forces?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on September 01, 2014, 01:32:18 am
Civil protests and a political campaign for uprooting the corruption in the police forces?
Better.

Although, America is a fairly racist country so it should be hard to get anything done.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on September 01, 2014, 01:39:59 am
Civil protests and a political campaign for uprooting the corruption in the police forces?

Well we see how well the police deal with protesters that are against them.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on September 01, 2014, 05:33:16 pm
On idea I've heard of that I liked was to have all cops wear body cams.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Sleepy on September 01, 2014, 06:05:27 pm
That's exactly what they've started doing.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/01/ferguson-cops-body-cameras_n_5747266.html (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/01/ferguson-cops-body-cameras_n_5747266.html)
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: RavynousHunter on September 01, 2014, 08:34:30 pm
Well, ain't that some shit?  Something might actually be done, for once.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Damen on September 01, 2014, 08:47:16 pm
Well, ain't that some shit?  Something might actually be done, for once.

(http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20130504072315/fallout/images/c/c4/Kirk_you-must-be-new-here.png)
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on September 01, 2014, 09:51:24 pm
The cops can just turn the camera off, as shown in this article.

http://jonathanturley.org/2014/08/19/new-orleans-police-officer-turns-off-body-camera-minutes-before-shooting-suspect-in-forehead/ (http://jonathanturley.org/2014/08/19/new-orleans-police-officer-turns-off-body-camera-minutes-before-shooting-suspect-in-forehead/)
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Askold on September 01, 2014, 11:28:41 pm
The cops can just turn the camera off, as shown in this article.

http://jonathanturley.org/2014/08/19/new-orleans-police-officer-turns-off-body-camera-minutes-before-shooting-suspect-in-forehead/ (http://jonathanturley.org/2014/08/19/new-orleans-police-officer-turns-off-body-camera-minutes-before-shooting-suspect-in-forehead/)
OH, that is just WRONG. I really like the idea of body cameras BECAUSE IT HELPS THE HONEST COPS AS WELL and turning it off should cause an automatic investigation even if no one gets shot.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on September 02, 2014, 01:45:41 am
Simple way to deal with this.  You turn the body camera off while you're on duty, FBI or State Police are notified and they come pick you up and you get a month in jail.

Ironbite-everybody wins!
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: TheUnknown on September 02, 2014, 01:59:32 am
Some people are arguing against this by invoking the slippery slope of "What, should they also be filmed while they're going to the bathroom, or on their break?  Would you like to monitored constantly on your job?  I bet you've said some unflattering things about your boss during break, and officers won't get to do that if they're always filmed.".

As some have pointed out, many workplaces do constantly monitor employees.  Someone else pointed out that constantly monitored cops could have problems in states where both parties in a recording need to consent to being recorded, which, even if you can argue around it, is a lot more reasonable than "how will they be able to freely spout shit that could come back and bite them in ass?".
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on September 11, 2014, 09:02:09 pm
New details on the case:
http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/cnn-new-video-shows-eyewitnesses-michael-brown-shooting (http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/cnn-new-video-shows-eyewitnesses-michael-brown-shooting)

Also, some news on that Wallmart shooting:#Invalid YouTube Link#
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on September 11, 2014, 09:13:24 pm
New details on the case:
http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/cnn-new-video-shows-eyewitnesses-michael-brown-shooting (http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/cnn-new-video-shows-eyewitnesses-michael-brown-shooting)

Also, some news on that Wallmart shooting:http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/09/09/man-who-called-911-in-ohio-walmart-shooting-changes-his-story-after-viewing-video/
 (http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/09/09/man-who-called-911-in-ohio-walmart-shooting-changes-his-story-after-viewing-video/)
FTFY
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on September 11, 2014, 10:10:02 pm
New details on the case:
http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/cnn-new-video-shows-eyewitnesses-michael-brown-shooting (http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/cnn-new-video-shows-eyewitnesses-michael-brown-shooting)

Also, some news on that Wallmart shooting:http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/09/09/man-who-called-911-in-ohio-walmart-shooting-changes-his-story-after-viewing-video/
 (http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/09/09/man-who-called-911-in-ohio-walmart-shooting-changes-his-story-after-viewing-video/)
FTFY
Thank you.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Danarth on September 12, 2014, 05:58:55 am
So, this is what the world looks like 150 years after slavery was abolished, huh?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on September 27, 2014, 05:19:10 pm
It looks like there's some good news.  The Ferguson police chief has apologized, and the Justice Department is cracking down.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on September 28, 2014, 03:06:16 am
How is that in any way shape or form "good news"?  This was what was always going to go down.  And that apology didn't come with his resignation letter nor is Officer Wilson behind bars awaiting processing to be put on trial for murder.

Ironbite-this town is going to go nova if the grand jury comes back with no charges filed against Wilson.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on September 28, 2014, 08:50:53 am
And now a cop's been shot.

http://news.yahoo.com/authorities-police-officer-shot-ferguson-033939406.html (http://news.yahoo.com/authorities-police-officer-shot-ferguson-033939406.html)

Why do I get the feeling things are gonna get even worse?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: mellenORL on September 28, 2014, 12:23:10 pm
Quote
Ferguson residents complained about the bracelets, which are black with "I am Darren Wilson" in white lettering, at a meeting with federal officials this week.

Love the subtlety of white lettering on black bands. Just scrap the entire Ferguson PD and hire private security companies to patrol, instead. After a few months, poll the residents as to which company they want to buy out and convert into their new police department.

(http://i.imgur.com/jYTwIGo.jpg)


Yup. Much more like it. That's actually a small but highly regarded security company from Atlanta. No body armor. No AR's. No murdering.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ironchew on September 28, 2014, 01:20:25 pm
Just scrap the entire Ferguson PD and hire private security companies to patrol, instead.

Not to downplay the ongoing disaster in Ferguson, but that sounds like a disaster waiting to happen. You're trading out a force that is (supposed to be) accountable to the citizens with forces accountable to whatever maximizes profits.

No AR's. No murdering.

New Orleans tried that experiment after Hurricane Katrina (http://www.motherjones.com/environment/2009/08/secret-history-hurricane-katrina) and they had a lot of armed goons doing a lot of murdering. I do not trust these companies enough to assume the same thing wouldn't happen again.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on September 28, 2014, 01:55:40 pm
Just scrap the entire Ferguson PD and hire private security companies to patrol, instead.

Not to downplay the ongoing disaster in Ferguson, but that sounds like a disaster waiting to happen. You're trading out a force that is (supposed to be) accountable to the citizens with forces accountable to whatever maximizes profits.

No AR's. No murdering.

New Orleans tried that experiment after Hurricane Katrina (http://www.motherjones.com/environment/2009/08/secret-history-hurricane-katrina) and they had a lot of armed goons doing a lot of murdering. I do not trust these companies enough to assume the same thing wouldn't happen again.

The sad thing is that there's not always an easy solution.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: mellenORL on September 28, 2014, 02:02:04 pm
Ironchew, did you see where I suggested that the "winning" security firm would be bought out by the City of Ferguson and the personnel incorporated into a new Department? I meant that as a regular, City government police department. In many states, to qualify for a license, armed security personnel must get their basic training under contract with local Sheriff's or even Highway Patrol police academies...but typically not the full 9 week boot camp, so not enough to "militarize" their mindsets. Any random group of licensed and surety bonded armed security guards could arguably be better than the institutionalized racial profiling, automatic stop-and-frisk, empty-your-clip-at-the-first-imagined-excuse modus operandi of all of the notorious commando PD's we keep seeing in the news. Regardless, just wiping clean an entire "problem" PD is a good idea, since that totally disrupts the interpersonal workplace dynamics that engendered and sustained corruption in the first place. Re-build the PD with all new hires from far outside of the community. And make sure they all pass background checks, personality and psych screening!
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ironchew on September 28, 2014, 02:47:18 pm
Re-build the PD with all new hires from far outside of the community.

That's just the trick, isn't it? Part of the problem the Ferguson police had in the first place was that a lot of them lived outside the community, which encouraged them to treat the place like a warzone full of scary black men.

Whatever they decide to do over there, the people that live there need to be in control of the process. Private firms are not accountable to them at the end of the day.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on September 28, 2014, 03:50:44 pm
Re-build the PD with all new hires from far outside of the community.

That's just the trick, isn't it? Part of the problem the Ferguson police had in the first place was that a lot of them lived outside the community, which encouraged them to treat the place like a warzone full of scary black men.

Whatever they decide to do over there, the people that live there need to be in control of the process. Private firms are not accountable to them at the end of the day.

Ironchew's right.  I'd say a major cause of police brutality is cops viewing themselves as apart from the community.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on September 28, 2014, 06:10:40 pm
And now a cop's been shot.

http://news.yahoo.com/authorities-police-officer-shot-ferguson-033939406.html (http://news.yahoo.com/authorities-police-officer-shot-ferguson-033939406.html)

Why do I get the feeling things are gonna get even worse?

The media and Twitter were in hysterics, but the two officers who have been shot were totally unrelated to the protests. One was an off-duty cop out of uniform in their civilian vehicle who had a bullet through the window and the other was pursuing a burglary suspect. They're as related to the protests as every other crime in the town.

Quote
Re-build the PD with all new hires from far outside of the community.

That is the absolute worst idea. Police departments already often suffer from a disconnect between the police and the community, resulting in them viewing the civilians as a group of "others" that they feel little attachment to and simply treat as potential threats. The vast, vast majority of conflict between current Ferguson PD and Ferguson residents is caused by the Ferguson police having little to no connection to the community that they ostensibly protected. A major complaint among Ferguson residents (some of whom I actually talk to over on Something Awful) is that their government is predominately white and has zero connection to the people that they govern. Bringing in an outside security firm to take over policing duties would be about as effective as hiring a PMC to act as your national military.

If you want to solve the town's policing problem, the only way to do that is by populating the police AND the government with Ferguson residents who actually have relationships with the people they serve.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Witchyjoshy on September 28, 2014, 07:29:23 pm
(https://40.media.tumblr.com/6474627392f6067623236cca24aa2309/tumblr_namg0k8eC61r0jlbgo1_500.jpg)

This is 2014, people...
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Lt. Fred on September 28, 2014, 08:08:48 pm
Why not just an independent anti-corruption commission outside the police force funded through some revenue stream that cannot be tinkered with by the government and with appointments made on a bipartisan, state-wide, basis?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Eiki-mun on September 28, 2014, 11:57:22 pm
So how long until the Ferguson Riots start?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on September 29, 2014, 12:24:49 am
So how long until the Ferguson Riots start?
Huh?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Eiki-mun on September 29, 2014, 12:32:23 am
So how long until the Ferguson Riots start?
Huh?

You know, when the Wilson asshole goes free and the whole city explodes. Kinda like the LA Riots from 20 years ago.

No wait, almost exactly like the LA Riots from 20 years ago.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on September 29, 2014, 12:45:04 am
Whenever the Grand Jury comes back.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on September 29, 2014, 01:29:23 am
So how long until the Ferguson Riots start?
Huh?

You know, when the Wilson asshole goes free and the whole city explodes. Kinda like the LA Riots from 20 years ago.

No wait, almost exactly like the LA Riots from 20 years ago.
Doubt that will happen.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Second Coming of Madman on September 29, 2014, 08:38:02 am
(https://40.media.tumblr.com/6474627392f6067623236cca24aa2309/tumblr_namg0k8eC61r0jlbgo1_500.jpg)

This is 2014, people...

Quote
So where's the skepticism towards these people receiving threats?

After all, they can just as easily be faking all of this shit.  Even/especially the syringe.

Somebody started trusting random people on Twitter? After all, the evidence may be there for you to see but it doesn't exist unless you acknowledge it!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UrgpZ0fUixs
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Witchyjoshy on September 29, 2014, 01:49:11 pm
There's two perfectly damn good gamergate threads out there, why do you feel the need to spread the shit everywhere?

Now I know how Art felt during the brony surge of 2011.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: RavynousHunter on September 29, 2014, 02:05:04 pm
...What?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on September 29, 2014, 02:14:48 pm
(https://40.media.tumblr.com/6474627392f6067623236cca24aa2309/tumblr_namg0k8eC61r0jlbgo1_500.jpg)

This is 2014, people...

Quote
So where's the skepticism towards these people receiving threats?

After all, they can just as easily be faking all of this shit.  Even/especially the syringe.

Somebody started trusting random people on Twitter? After all, the evidence may be there for you to see but it doesn't exist unless you acknowledge it!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UrgpZ0fUixs

Madman, please keep GamerGate stuff where it belongs.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: RavynousHunter on September 29, 2014, 02:28:03 pm
Since when are we not allowed to post the same thing to two threads if the same post applies in both contexts?  We're getting a little touchy today, aren't we?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Witchyjoshy on September 29, 2014, 02:43:28 pm
Since when are we not allowed to post the same thing to two threads if the same post applies in both contexts?  We're getting a little touchy today, aren't we?

How about this:

I've not had any decent sleep last night.
I've been sick of Gamergate for all month.
I'm sick of having it shoved down my throat in an attempt to force me and others to pick a side.
I'm sick of people trying to drag in drama from other threads.
I'm sick of those same people failing at reading comprehension in the first place.

So yes, I'm more than a little touchy.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on September 29, 2014, 02:49:08 pm
Since when are we not allowed to post the same thing to two threads if the same post applies in both contexts?  We're getting a little touchy today, aren't we?

How about this:

I've not had any decent sleep last night.
I've been sick of Gamergate for all month.
I'm sick of having it shoved down my throat in an attempt to force me and others to pick a side.
I'm sick of people trying to drag in drama from other threads.
I'm sick of those same people failing at reading comprehension in the first place.

So yes, I'm more than a little touchy.

You have my sympathies.

So, back on topic.  Maybe they could take a few lessons from the LAPD.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on September 30, 2014, 12:51:55 am
Since when are we not allowed to post the same thing to two threads if the same post applies in both contexts?  We're getting a little touchy today, aren't we?

How about this:

I've not had any decent sleep last night.
I've been sick of Gamergate for all month.
I'm sick of having it shoved down my throat in an attempt to force me and others to pick a side.
I'm sick of people trying to drag in drama from other threads.
I'm sick of those same people failing at reading comprehension in the first place.

So yes, I'm more than a little touchy.

I'm sick and tired of being sick and tired!
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Witchyjoshy on September 30, 2014, 03:31:39 am
Since when are we not allowed to post the same thing to two threads if the same post applies in both contexts?  We're getting a little touchy today, aren't we?

How about this:

I've not had any decent sleep last night.
I've been sick of Gamergate for all month.
I'm sick of having it shoved down my throat in an attempt to force me and others to pick a side.
I'm sick of people trying to drag in drama from other threads.
I'm sick of those same people failing at reading comprehension in the first place.

So yes, I'm more than a little touchy.

I'm sick and tired of being sick and tired!

That too.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on September 30, 2014, 12:28:03 pm
So I've got a dumb question.

Do the Ferguson police know what the First Amendment is? (http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/crime-and-courts/ferguson-protesters-claim-arrests-were-orchestrated-to-squelch-dissent/article_ec4fa4e8-69b6-5d90-bf40-2c1ce03e8d27.html)

Quote
Arrests Sunday night in downtown Ferguson raised accusations that those detained were being held as hostages by police to quiet and break up the crowd.
At one point Sunday night, about 300 people gathered on South Florissant Road across from the Ferguson police station. The Organization for Black Struggle invited their “white allies” to join them with pots and makeshift drums to make a lot of noise, which they beat while chanting.

Eight were arrested on charges of resisting arrest and failure to obey the police.

Protesters, black and white, complained that none were read their Miranda rights. Some believed the arrests were orchestrated by police to gain negotiating leverage with the protesters.

Several legal observers said people appeared to be picked out of the crowd randomly while legally protesting on the sidewalk.

Michael Allen, a building preservation advocate, said he was arrested after locking arms with other protesters and entering the street. Allen said he and others were arrested even after telling police they would return to the sidewalk. Those throwing water bottles at police were left alone, he said. He said he and seven others were put in a police van to be transported to the St. Ann jail for processing.

“Nobody who threw an object was arrested,” Allen said. “They arrested the exact number of people that could fit in the paddy wagon. They filled it with eight people.”

Allen said prior to being transported they were told by a Ferguson officer with no name tag that they would not have to post bail to get out of jail that night and that the process would be quick. The group asked if they would be read their Miranda rights but were told that was unnecessary because they would not be questioned. Allen said he and the others had to sign a form indicating he knew he had been arrested and his charges.

Ironbite-cause I'm pretty sure they don't know what the First Amendment is.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: RavynousHunter on September 30, 2014, 03:24:07 pm
That's like something you'd see out of North Korea.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Eiki-mun on September 30, 2014, 05:06:54 pm
Can we just line up the Ferguson police and shoot them all? It's pretty clear by now that every last pig bastard there deserves a firing squad.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Zygarde on September 30, 2014, 05:14:10 pm
....That seems a bit excessive .
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Eiki-mun on September 30, 2014, 05:14:47 pm
So does using protesters as hostages.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on September 30, 2014, 06:30:35 pm
So I've got a dumb question.

Do the Ferguson police know what the First Amendment is? (http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/crime-and-courts/ferguson-protesters-claim-arrests-were-orchestrated-to-squelch-dissent/article_ec4fa4e8-69b6-5d90-bf40-2c1ce03e8d27.html)

Quote
Arrests Sunday night in downtown Ferguson raised accusations that those detained were being held as hostages by police to quiet and break up the crowd.
At one point Sunday night, about 300 people gathered on South Florissant Road across from the Ferguson police station. The Organization for Black Struggle invited their “white allies” to join them with pots and makeshift drums to make a lot of noise, which they beat while chanting.

Eight were arrested on charges of resisting arrest and failure to obey the police.

Protesters, black and white, complained that none were read their Miranda rights. Some believed the arrests were orchestrated by police to gain negotiating leverage with the protesters.

Several legal observers said people appeared to be picked out of the crowd randomly while legally protesting on the sidewalk.

Michael Allen, a building preservation advocate, said he was arrested after locking arms with other protesters and entering the street. Allen said he and others were arrested even after telling police they would return to the sidewalk. Those throwing water bottles at police were left alone, he said. He said he and seven others were put in a police van to be transported to the St. Ann jail for processing.

“Nobody who threw an object was arrested,” Allen said. “They arrested the exact number of people that could fit in the paddy wagon. They filled it with eight people.”

Allen said prior to being transported they were told by a Ferguson officer with no name tag that they would not have to post bail to get out of jail that night and that the process would be quick. The group asked if they would be read their Miranda rights but were told that was unnecessary because they would not be questioned. Allen said he and the others had to sign a form indicating he knew he had been arrested and his charges.

Ironbite-cause I'm pretty sure they don't know what the First Amendment is.
Sure they do, it's the right of the aryan race can deal with them niggers and nigger lovers when they get uppity!
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Sleepy on September 30, 2014, 07:20:36 pm
Can we just line up the Ferguson police and shoot them all? It's pretty clear by now that every last pig bastard there deserves a firing squad.

Are we really going to have another "all cops are pigs!" argument? You've been really irritating with this issue and don't seem to recognize that the actions of these officers don't extend to police across the nation.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: mythbuster43 on September 30, 2014, 09:22:39 pm
Can we just line up the Ferguson police and shoot them all? It's pretty clear by now that every last pig bastard there deserves a firing squad.

Calm your tits, Huey Newton. That line of thought only reinforces the kind of stereotypes that allow police to believe that brutality and profiling are not only okay, but warranted.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Eiki-mun on September 30, 2014, 11:35:05 pm
Can we just line up the Ferguson police and shoot them all? It's pretty clear by now that every last pig bastard there deserves a firing squad.

Are we really going to have another "all cops are pigs!" argument? You've been really irritating with this issue and don't seem to recognize that the actions of these officers don't extend to police across the nation.

Very well. I'll step out of the thread.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on October 01, 2014, 12:49:20 am
Would be nice.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cerim Treascair on October 01, 2014, 05:21:51 pm
We do have our limits.  Sure, it comes up every once in a while, but when a prior thread goes for 17 pages in F&B over it, it kinda pisses the rest of us off.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 15, 2014, 10:11:35 am
Bringing this back as a grand jury decision is expected any day now.

Ironbite-get ready to hit the fallout shelters
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 15, 2014, 10:23:19 am
Bringing this back as a grand jury decision is expected any day now.

Ironbite-get ready to hit the fallout shelters
It's gonna be not guilty.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 15, 2014, 11:59:16 am
That would be if this was a trial.  They haven't even voted to indite.

Ironbite-hence why I said grand jury
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 15, 2014, 12:01:45 pm
That would be if this was a trial.  They haven't even voted to indite.

Ironbite-hence why I said grand jury
I like how the jury just happens to be mostly white in a mostly black city.
*cough*BULLSHIT*cough*
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cerim Treascair on November 15, 2014, 02:21:32 pm
This will end badly, no matter what the result is.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Eiki-mun on November 15, 2014, 02:32:55 pm
There is no chance the cop will be indicted. This is going to blow up.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 17, 2014, 04:43:23 pm
The Governor of Missouri just called a state of emergency.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 17, 2014, 05:29:05 pm
Argness in advance of stupidity.  They're betting on people going nuts when Wilson gets off scot free because the DA has no interest in going after him.

Ironbite-it'll be a firestorm.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 17, 2014, 05:59:08 pm
I'm worried this is gonna be Rodney King 2: Electric Boogaloo.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cerim Treascair on November 17, 2014, 06:12:21 pm
This will probably make the LA Riots look tame.  Hoo boy.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: RavynousHunter on November 17, 2014, 06:15:25 pm
I'll be sentient for it, this time!
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: SpaceProg on November 17, 2014, 09:43:51 pm
I was sentient for the first one.  It wasn't pretty, that's for sure.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cerim Treascair on November 17, 2014, 10:53:18 pm
What was it like, Proggy? I was probably eight and wasn't watching the news at that time.  All I've ever seen is brief clips.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on November 17, 2014, 11:24:27 pm
So, anyone know when the decision will be? I'm assuming it's gonna be tomorrow if they're declaring a state of emergency today. Also, when you feel you need to preempt the announcement of a decision by declaring a state of emergency, something's wrong. Declaring a state of emergency means they can have the national guard come in, right?

Anyone know if Vice will be doing live streaming of the real action again.

I wonder if it will get as bad as the Tulsa race riots, which while largely unknown and unspoken about, when it is rarely mentioned it usually gets the called the worst race riot in the country's history. At one point military aircraft may have been (Probably were) used to fire bomb the city's black district. The city's founder, kkk member, and participant in the riot W. Tate Brady still has an entire district of the city that bears his name. He was also appointed to a committee whose purpose was to make restrictive building codes to prevent the rebuilding of the black district.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulsa_race_riot (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulsa_race_riot)
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 17, 2014, 11:53:54 pm
This will probably make the LA Riots look tame.  Hoo boy.
Or it'll be about as much a riot as it was before.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: SpaceProg on November 18, 2014, 12:23:12 am
What was it like, Proggy? I was probably eight and wasn't watching the news at that time.  All I've ever seen is brief clips.
Chaos.  Plain and simple.

The rioting broke out in various places at various times.  Kind of like what meteorologists call 'popcorn storms'.    There'd be a time of quiet in said place, then all hell would break loose.  Like the insanity was a living thing just wandering around aimlessly for the lulz.
Looting, vandalism, and people just minding their own business getting curb stomped for the crime of ... existing, I guess.  There were even people dragged out of their vehicles and beaten.  I remember clearly about a truck driver that was dragged out of his big rig and hoods just wailed away on him.  A lot of the victims were lucky they even survived.

What's so sad is that I think that most of the violence wasn't caused by the verdict as much as people just wanted an excuse to be shitty to one another and get away with it because they'd be lost in the crowd/the police would be overtaxed and distracted with the crap going down everywhere.

It was a perfect example of man's inhumanity to man. 
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 21, 2014, 06:42:08 am
A decision is most likely gonna happen this weekend.  So let's see how bad it'll be!
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on November 21, 2014, 12:40:05 pm
A Navy vet working at a hotel in Chesterfield (30 minutes from Ferguson) was fired and accused of being a terrorist for taking a picture (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/man-fired-homeland-security-photos-ferguson-article-1.2015554) of close to 100 Department of Homeland Security vehicles parked in the hotel parking garage.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 21, 2014, 02:05:44 pm
Woooow
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on November 21, 2014, 03:20:17 pm
It sounds like they're expecting this to turn in to an all out war zone. This is definitely gonna be interesting. The KKK is threatening violence against protesters in a flyer they're spreading apparently.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 21, 2014, 05:14:30 pm
Report leaked that Officer Wilson might be resigning after the decision is made.  They're negotiating with him as we speak.

Ironbite-oh if only they hadn't spent the last 100+ days practically defending him.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Sleepy on November 21, 2014, 05:23:44 pm
I'll be shocked if he doesn't resign, frankly. I can't imagine he'd last long as a traditional police officer.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on November 21, 2014, 06:06:12 pm
It sounds like they're expecting this to turn in to an all out war zone. This is definitely gonna be interesting. The KKK is threatening violence against protesters in a flyer they're spreading apparently.

During the August protests, their main method of cracking down was to roll out excessive force and agitate the protesters until even a single bottle was thrown at them, at which point they began firing tear gas and arresting journalists. They then used the media to retroactively justify their assault by spinning the tiny handful of looters and people throwing rocks or bottles into the entire protest being a massive riot that they had to put down.

I think that's their plan here. By presenting a massive show of force and declaring a state of emergency before anything has even occurred, they present the image of Ferguson being a powder keg of black violence waiting to blow. When they begin committing civil rights violations again, they can go "See? We prepared!"
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Second Coming of Madman on November 21, 2014, 06:37:44 pm
The evil that men do.

The evil that men do...
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 21, 2014, 06:53:49 pm
It sounds like they're expecting this to turn in to an all out war zone. This is definitely gonna be interesting. The KKK is threatening violence against protesters in a flyer they're spreading apparently.

During the August protests, their main method of cracking down was to roll out excessive force and agitate the protesters until even a single bottle was thrown at them, at which point they began firing tear gas and arresting journalists. They then used the media to retroactively justify their assault by spinning the tiny handful of looters and people throwing rocks or bottles into the entire protest being a massive riot that they had to put down.

I think that's their plan here. By presenting a massive show of force and declaring a state of emergency before anything has even occurred, they present the image of Ferguson being a powder keg of black violence waiting to blow. When they begin committing civil rights violations again, they can go "See? We prepared!"

I hate to sound like UP for a moment but at least some of those instances where the protest became a "riot" was because of plain clothes officers being planted in the crowd and then after awhile, a bottle gets thrown harmlessly at the police and thus the whole crowd is declared a "riot" and the crack downs begin.

Ironbite-not all but at least some of those "riots" started that way.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on November 22, 2014, 12:55:35 am
It sounds like they're expecting this to turn in to an all out war zone. This is definitely gonna be interesting. The KKK is threatening violence against protesters in a flyer they're spreading apparently.

During the August protests, their main method of cracking down was to roll out excessive force and agitate the protesters until even a single bottle was thrown at them, at which point they began firing tear gas and arresting journalists. They then used the media to retroactively justify their assault by spinning the tiny handful of looters and people throwing rocks or bottles into the entire protest being a massive riot that they had to put down.

I think that's their plan here. By presenting a massive show of force and declaring a state of emergency before anything has even occurred, they present the image of Ferguson being a powder keg of black violence waiting to blow. When they begin committing civil rights violations again, they can go "See? We prepared!"

I hate to sound like UP for a moment but at least some of those instances where the protest became a "riot" was because of plain clothes officers being planted in the crowd and then after awhile, a bottle gets thrown harmlessly at the police and thus the whole crowd is declared a "riot" and the crack downs begin.

Ironbite-not all but at least some of those "riots" started that way.

Sources?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 22, 2014, 04:11:02 pm
Damn not finding any sources that I'd rely on.  I know I read a series of tweets at one point during the peak of the protests back in.....October I wanna say where someone pointed out a bunch of plain clothes cops were instigating something to give the uniformed officers cause to break up a peaceful protest but for the life of me I can't find anything and a google search isn't giving me anything I'd rely on.  Consider it an unbacked claim that I'm pretty sure happened but I can't prove and will fully admit to it.  If I find something I will definitely post it.  Of course the reason I do give this claim is look at how this department has been treating reporters and protesters.  It's not a stretch that they'd insert some of their own in order to make the people look like mindless rioters.

In other news the Grand Jury has the weekend off and won't reconvene till Monday.  I wonder why.

Ironbite-possibly to give more time to Wilson's legal team to squeeze a few more pennies out?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on November 22, 2014, 08:40:35 pm
http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/crime-and-courts/ferguson-by-the-numbers/article_5ec448a4-3f08-5861-813c-d03bed1c9784.html

A very important article for anyone convinced that Ferguson is somehow a war zone.

One of the biggest things to take away: two major weather events in St. Louis caused 640 times more damage than the protests.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 22, 2014, 09:28:26 pm
Right because weather events take away civil liberties and make second class citizens over people with an average skin tone that is a few shades below barrister white.

Ironbite-exactly what does this prove?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: niam2023 on November 22, 2014, 10:09:04 pm
Ferguson is still a dangerous warzone, and most likely, if Wilson goes free, he won't be free and ALIVE for very long.

There aren't really good or bad guys in such an atmosphere. Just the usual - war is hell, and there are a lot of demons.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on November 22, 2014, 11:35:34 pm
Right because weather events take away civil liberties and make second class citizens over people with an average skin tone that is a few shades below barrister white.

Ironbite-exactly what does this prove?

...wow, I literally didn't think anyone could misinterpret that. I'm impressed. Did you actually open the article and read it?

The point of the article is proving that despite the media's focus on Ferguson being a violent, semi-lawless community filled with shattered glass and black thugs rioting and burning down storefronts, it hasn't even managed to match a hailstorm in terms of damage. Almost all of the injuries caused have been from police to civilians (with no police officers even staying at a hospital overnight from injuries and a minority being hurt) and not a single person has died.

Quote
Ferguson is still a dangerous warzone, and most likely, if Wilson goes free, he won't be free and ALIVE for very long.

It's not. It's really, really clearly not. Anyone who looks at stuff other than cherrypicked images of vandals and riot cops shooting tear gas in August would know that. Literally almost all of the protesting and looting (with a stupidly tiny minority of the civilians involved actually being looters or rioters, which I witnessed on the livestreams of the protests in August) has been restricted to a section of West Florissant Avenue.

Insisting that Ferguson is actively dangerous (and especially that any danger comes from anyone but the police) only serves to justify the massively disproportionate police response.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 23, 2014, 10:33:15 am
Oh nice subtle insult there implying that I can't read.  But I do ask again.  How is what's going on in Ferguson right now even comparable to a natural disaster?  It's pears and peaches man.  Not even remotely compatable.

Also ok you win.  It's no long a warzone.  There happy?  So what changes?  Nothing.  Glad we established that.

Ironbite-seriously this is going to be a warzone once the Grand Jury comes out with a decision.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Askold on November 23, 2014, 10:59:17 am
Oh nice subtle insult there implying that I can't read.  But I do ask again.  How is what's going on in Ferguson right now even comparable to a natural disaster?  It's pears and peaches man.  Not even remotely compatable.


Ironbite... He didn't imply that you can't read. He just asked if you actually read the article at all.

The reason why they natural disasters were brought up in the article was that by comparing the value of damages reported to insurance companies in Ferguson and and in areas struck by natural disasters (they also compared the damages to those from LA riots) was that they wanted to show that the amount of damages have been quite low and the media has blown the thing out of proportion.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 23, 2014, 12:55:22 pm
There aren't really good or bad guys in such an atmosphere. Just the usual - war is hell, and there are a lot of demons.
Well there is actually, the good guys being the peacfull protestors, the bad guys being the cops who have sent dozens of poeple to the hospital for unlawful use of force.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Dakota Bob on November 23, 2014, 02:29:33 pm
So when is the jury decision expected?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on November 23, 2014, 11:50:48 pm
According to the local news protesters are already "clashing with police again" and about a dozen people have been arrested in the last few days. Some police from here in Tulsa apparently went to Ferguson to "support their fellow officers" by cooking food for them.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 24, 2014, 02:43:06 pm
Battan down the hatches folks.  The grand jury is done.

Ironbite-prepare for a shit storm
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on November 24, 2014, 02:45:15 pm
Battan down the hatches folks.  The grand jury is done.

Ironbite-prepare for a shit storm

I heard they're gonna wait for 48 hours before announcing it.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: SpaceProg on November 24, 2014, 02:50:03 pm
Oooh just like sweeps week.  Gotta have a good cliffhanger.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 24, 2014, 03:13:53 pm
Earliest we'll hear any thing is by 5.  Give time to get schools out.  Should be fun!
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Eiki-mun on November 24, 2014, 03:16:06 pm
I live in Sacramento. Should I batten down the hatches and stay home?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 24, 2014, 05:30:16 pm
This is gonna be like the trayvon Martin riots.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: mellenORL on November 24, 2014, 05:39:40 pm
There were no Trayvon Martin verdict riots. There were hundreds of peaceful protests, for many months afterwards, both here and around the world. It was just a very sad and somber day here in Orlando where the verdict was reached.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 24, 2014, 06:02:45 pm
There were no Trayvon Martin verdict riots. There were hundreds of peaceful protests, for many months afterwards, both here and around the world. It was just a very sad and somber day here in Orlando where the verdict was reached.
Exactly.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 24, 2014, 06:16:21 pm
No Lizard.  This is going to be nothing like that.

Ironbite-the Ferguson police have made it perfectly clear what the people's right to protest means to them.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: SkyTrekTower on November 24, 2014, 06:35:40 pm
I'm not expecting first degree murder charges, but I do hope for charges like second degree murder, manslaughter, or reckless homicide.  I just see first degree murder being too hard to prove.

That being said, if deadly force was justified, unfortunately, Daren Wilson would not have had to stop even if Michael Brown had his hands up(which is a whole new issue).  Both sides seem so sure of their side being right, with the main argument being their side would have to be incredibly stupid to be in the wrong/why would they lie?  Well the side in the wrong is stupid, and whatever side is in the wrong has reason to lie.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 24, 2014, 06:58:52 pm
No Lizard.  This is going to be nothing like that.

Ironbite-the Ferguson police have made it perfectly clear what the people's right to protest means to them.
I know, my point was that there aren't going to be any riots but the media will start hyping the idea that spooky black ppl gonna get u.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: SpaceProg on November 24, 2014, 07:12:44 pm
Black people are 3 spoopy 5 me.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: mellenORL on November 24, 2014, 07:14:28 pm
There are way too many LEOs on the ground there already. Nobody likes to pay to cater a big party just to have it rained out. Police riots are a thing. No matter how the MSM spins it.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Second Coming of Madman on November 24, 2014, 07:40:58 pm
Selma all over again.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 24, 2014, 07:57:54 pm
Gonna be decided in about an hour.

Ironbite-this is gonna be interesting.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 24, 2014, 08:24:17 pm
http://fortressamerica.gawker.com/ferguson-cop-supporters-crowdfunded-a-pants-up-dont-l-1659644867/+laceydonohue (http://fortressamerica.gawker.com/ferguson-cop-supporters-crowdfunded-a-pants-up-dont-l-1659644867/+laceydonohue)
Hope this is fake, wouldn't be surprised if it isn't though.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 24, 2014, 09:01:43 pm
"Not Guilty" verdicts gonna be delivered any minute now.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cerim Treascair on November 24, 2014, 09:10:14 pm
Live feed for the announcement of the verdict is up.  It's Yahoo, but it's something:

http://news.yahoo.com/ferguson-grand-jury-decision-darren-wilson-live-153912750.html
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 24, 2014, 09:17:46 pm
"Not Guilty" verdicts gonna be delivered any minute now.

Not charged with anything.  This is not a trial dippy.

Ironbite-it's a grand jury
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on November 24, 2014, 09:19:08 pm
Apparently the courthouse the press conference is being held in is secured and barricaded by the national guard.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 24, 2014, 09:21:28 pm
Because Wilson's about to get away with murder.

Ironbite-GET ON WITH IT GOD DAMN IT!
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 24, 2014, 09:24:59 pm
"Not Guilty" verdicts gonna be delivered any minute now.

Not charged with anything.  This is not a trial dippy.

Ironbite-it's a grand jury
Does it matter? EIther way Wilson gets away scott free.

Sorry, I'm just tired and depressed.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 24, 2014, 09:25:54 pm
Yes...yes it does matter.

Ironbite-cause double

FUCKING HELL!
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on November 24, 2014, 09:26:20 pm
He got off. Batten down the hatches.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 24, 2014, 09:26:29 pm
Officer Derren Wilson gets away with murdering Micheal Brown.

Ironbite-thereby concluding that a black kid's life means nothing.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 24, 2014, 09:26:59 pm
Officer Derren Wilson gets away with murdering Micheal Brown.

Ironbite-thereby concluding that a black kid's life means nothing.
Yup.

Wilson could have taken a video of him shooting Brown in the head and would still get away with it.

Same fucking story we've heard a million times.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cerim Treascair on November 24, 2014, 09:27:24 pm
This is gonna get messy.  Fuck.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 24, 2014, 09:28:15 pm
I have a thought....this is just state charges.  Could there be federal charges in the pipeline?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Sleepy on November 24, 2014, 09:30:04 pm
No indictment. I saw this coming, but the prosecutor made it even more obvious when he began his speech by calling out witnesses with false testimony, stating that we all have the right to use deadly force in certain circumstances, etc. This is not going to be pretty.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 24, 2014, 09:30:23 pm
I have a thought....this is just state charges.  Could there be federal charges in the pipeline?

Maybe.  Let's hope so.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on November 24, 2014, 09:30:48 pm
Here comes the wall of riot shields... Anyone know if there's live coverage from within the crowd like Vice did last time?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Zygarde on November 24, 2014, 09:31:22 pm
Well this disappoints me, although I did see it coming for some reason I hope it doesn't start anything destructive, but knowing how things like this turn out I won't hold my breath. Again disappointed since this basicly says my life is some how even worth less. (gods gotta love being black in this country.) 
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on November 24, 2014, 09:35:02 pm
Never mind my question, Vice is live from Ferguson.

https://news.vice.com/article/live-from-the-streets-of-ferguson (https://news.vice.com/article/live-from-the-streets-of-ferguson)

I hear glass shattering. Some bottles are being thrown, and others are trying to stop the bottle throwing. At least one guy tried to start a chant of "Fuck the po-lice".
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 24, 2014, 09:36:43 pm
Never mind my question, Vice is live from Ferguson.

https://news.vice.com/article/live-from-the-streets-of-ferguson (https://news.vice.com/article/live-from-the-streets-of-ferguson)

I hear glass shattering. Some bottles are being thrown, and others are trying to stop the bottle throwing. At least one guy tried to start a chant of "Fuck the po-lice".
Well, that's gonna be enough for the media to label them as a bunch of degenerate nigger thugs
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Second Coming of Madman on November 24, 2014, 09:38:04 pm
Not indicted.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 24, 2014, 09:38:38 pm
Never mind my question, Vice is live from Ferguson.

https://news.vice.com/article/live-from-the-streets-of-ferguson (https://news.vice.com/article/live-from-the-streets-of-ferguson)

I hear glass shattering. Some bottles are being thrown, and others are trying to stop the bottle throwing. At least one guy tried to start a chant of "Fuck the po-lice".
Well, that's gonna be enough for the media to label them as a bunch of degenerate nigger thugs

Unless you're black, I'd hesitate to use the "n-word" if I were you.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 24, 2014, 09:39:44 pm
I have a thought....this is just state charges.  Could there be federal charges in the pipeline?

Maybe.  Let's hope so.
Michael was black, there's no Wilson will face any charges.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Zygarde on November 24, 2014, 09:40:21 pm
Not speaking for all black people but I don't give a shit, plus I think that was meant to be what the media is probably thinking (but won't say since you know media.)
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 24, 2014, 09:40:26 pm
Federal charges Lizard. That's a whole nother ball game.

Ironbite-and one this douche of a DA won't have a prayer of actually stopping.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 24, 2014, 09:42:34 pm
I have a thought....this is just state charges.  Could there be federal charges in the pipeline?

Maybe.  Let's hope so.
Michael was black, there's no Wilson will face any charges.

Considering that both the President and the Attorney General are black, I'm more hopeful.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 24, 2014, 09:45:11 pm
I have a thought....this is just state charges.  Could there be federal charges in the pipeline?

Maybe.  Let's hope so.
Michael was black, there's no Wilson will face any charges.

Considering that both the President and the Attorney General are black, I'm more hopeful.
That's true, although they weren't able to get charges brought in the Trayvon Martin case.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 24, 2014, 09:47:44 pm
...Zimmerman went to trial.  That idiot of a DA let him off.

Ironbite-do you live in the same reality as the rest of us?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 24, 2014, 09:49:11 pm
...Zimmerman went to trial.  That idiot of a DA let him off.

Ironbite-do you live in the same reality as the rest of us?
Sorry.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on November 24, 2014, 09:57:08 pm
I heard shots being fired in the video. The comments to any of the Ferguson articles on vice are exactly as... lovely, as you would expect.

To quote the Vice cameraman just now, "shit's goin' down."
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 24, 2014, 09:57:28 pm
...Zimmerman went to trial.  That idiot of a DA let him off.

Ironbite-do you live in the same reality as the rest of us?
Sorry.

That's okay.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 24, 2014, 10:00:40 pm
Saw this posted on Tumblr:
Quote
In America it’s reasonable to say an unarmed black kid deserved to be shot six times because he might have robbed a convenience store, but a white kid shouldn’t be kicked off the high school football team just because he violently raped a girl.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on November 24, 2014, 10:01:21 pm
Oh, by the way, there are mercs in the town. It was apparently a merc who confirmed that the sounds where likely gunfire. There were hired by area businesses.

Here's a rather insane section of one of the vice articles. https://news.vice.com/article/its-official-ferguson-officer-darren-wilson-will-not-face-charges-for-killing-michael-brown (https://news.vice.com/article/its-official-ferguson-officer-darren-wilson-will-not-face-charges-for-killing-michael-brown)

Quote
A man wearing a black hoodie emblazoned with the words "I Am Michael Brown" paced in circles around a memorial for the fallen teenager, threatening violence.

"It ain't safe down here for white people," the man said. "If y'all say he ain't guilty, then I'm killing somebody."

Several businesses on West Florissant Avenue, the main drag in Ferguson, were boarded up to prevent looting. JB Bransford, 15, said that the wood would not make a difference if Wilson was declared innocent.

"If they say he ain't guilty, we're breaking through that wood," Bransford said. "We got chainsaws down here."
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Iczerfour on November 24, 2014, 10:03:33 pm
watching live feed.. 
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on November 24, 2014, 10:12:33 pm
Swat APCs are rolling in and they are telling people to get out of the street or they will be arrested. Obama is giving a speech as we speak.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 24, 2014, 10:19:08 pm
And now the town burns.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Second Coming of Madman on November 24, 2014, 10:25:54 pm
Ecce homo in action, kids! Have a good look while it lasts!
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: niam2023 on November 24, 2014, 10:31:19 pm
Wilson ain't leaving Ferguson alive.

This town, going by the mercenaries, the gunshots, the psycho-police, and the rioters, is going to burn down.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Svata on November 24, 2014, 10:32:20 pm
Well, looks like the name of this thread needs to be changed since the man has been cleared of any manner of murder.


This post is entirely sarcastic. Please, don't be mad, I don't mean it in the least.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Eiki-mun on November 24, 2014, 10:35:15 pm
You're right. Petition to rename it "Ferguson Government-Sponsored Murder".
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on November 24, 2014, 10:35:29 pm
Apparently during the last time the feed cut out they got heavily gassed and as soon as the video came back you could here the shots of either shotguns or teargas grenade launchers. I can see the continued grenade fire. Also a cop car got smashed out, which apparently sparked this. I heard a massive boom, but can't tell what it is. There are ear gas canisters littering the streets. Windows have been smashed by protesters, with other protesters trying to block them from doing so. The Police are falling back to the police station.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on November 24, 2014, 10:38:02 pm
Shit's on fire! Edit: just a trash can.

The police claim on Twitter they only shot smoke grenades, despite them obviously being tear gas.

More explosion sounds and grenade/shotgun fire.

There has not been gunshots that sound different from the police fire.

The Police just shot tear gas in to a car it seems.

There are people, including one where what I can best describe as a light-up tron mask, that are defending the stores and are standing guard in the areas where there aren't police.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 24, 2014, 10:47:07 pm
You're right. Petition to rename it "Ferguson Self-Defenseing".
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 24, 2014, 10:48:19 pm
Wilson ain't leaving Ferguson alive.

This town, going by the mercenaries, the gunshots, the psycho-police, and the rioters, is going to burn down.
As much as I love a good riot, I think declaring it one right now is to premature.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on November 24, 2014, 10:54:32 pm
Wilson ain't leaving Ferguson alive.

This town, going by the mercenaries, the gunshots, the psycho-police, and the rioters, is going to burn down.
As much as I love a good riot, I think declaring it one right now is to premature.

Opportunist looters aside, most of the action seems to be coming from the police. Supposedly they fired tear gas on a group of people trying to load a woman who had a heart attack in to an ambulance. As soon as she was in the ambulance the police fired tear gas grenades at them.

Edit: An army of swat guys are moving somewhere behind an APC and two cop cars are on fire. Shit is going down hard.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Søren on November 24, 2014, 10:56:24 pm
My only interest in this is mocking the people on tumblr that get angry at their mutuals for not reblogging.

Its fantastic
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: mellenORL on November 24, 2014, 11:00:54 pm
Classic police riot in the making. They brought too many toys to not play with them.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 24, 2014, 11:03:12 pm
Classic police riot in the making. They brought too many toys to not play with them.
http://www.theonion.com/articles/heavy-police-presence-in-ferguson-to-ensure-reside,37528/ (http://www.theonion.com/articles/heavy-police-presence-in-ferguson-to-ensure-reside,37528/)
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on November 24, 2014, 11:11:04 pm
More and more The Onion is becoming less satire and more prophecy.

http://www.theonion.com/articles/battleship-awkwardly-propped-up-against-ferguson-p,36719/ (http://www.theonion.com/articles/battleship-awkwardly-propped-up-against-ferguson-p,36719/)

(http://o.onionstatic.com/images/27/27062/original/700.jpg?3204)

Some journalist got their stuff jacked from their car while they were in it!
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Eiki-mun on November 24, 2014, 11:30:19 pm
It's clear by now: Black people can expect no defense from cops. They need to take matters into their own hands, and exercise their 2nd Amendment right to bear arms. Because in modern America, they have no other line of defense.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Iczerfour on November 25, 2014, 12:09:50 am
wow things are really on fire now..
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on November 25, 2014, 12:15:44 am
As the Vice crew are putting on there bulletproof vests, one guy said "I really never wanted to have to put my vest on in an American city. For perspective, the last time I had to wear this was in Gaza."

Shit is going down even harder than I imagined it would.

Oh shit, There was just a huge explosion!

Edit: The police are claiming they're taking fire.

The horizon is glowing orange with fire. I've jokingly said I wanted to see the world burn, guess I got it.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 25, 2014, 12:31:26 am
Yeah, I'm not believing shit the cops say there.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Eiki-mun on November 25, 2014, 12:32:48 am
The police can claim all they want. We all know they lie.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Id82 on November 25, 2014, 01:38:39 am
I just have to post to rant.
So I was watching the Ferguson debacle going on with my conservative father in law, on Fox news of course. In which he decided to bring up that you should never go for a cops gun what was that stupid kid thinking. And then says that the cop was only defending himself, you know how many people are killed trying to attack a cop, and all of the protestors in Ferguson don't realize this. They just want to rob stores and get away with it.
I tried to bring up how it's not about the crime that occured, it's about black people feeling targeted as criminals. It's been building up to this since Trayvon, and the man that shot and killed that black kid at the gas station. It's a group frustration against the injustices being brought towards them
He then proceeded in telling me, yeah and just how many black people killed haven't they talked about between those crimes. Why are those deaths significant? Then went on a rant on how black people are a very violent culture which goes back to their African roots. There are a lot of black people in jail because they are violent. He then went to compare them to Japanese people, where Japan has very little crime and harsh punishments in prison. Asian people come over here and don't start crime and are very successful.
When I tried to bring up how guns are banned in Japan, which may contribute to less crime and less deaths. He brought up how guns kill very little people and that they save over 2 million people a year. Hispanics and blacks join gains blah blah blah. At this point I shut off my ears and tried to stop listening as he went on a tirade about how he was witnessed to violent black people growing up. He sounded like a living fox news talking point.

I just couldn't believe what I was hearing. He pretty much just said that black people as a whole are violent, and are most likely to cause crimes.
I hate how conservatives always seem to attack problems at the surface instead of trying to fix what causes the problems in the first place. Black people cause more crime and violence, well throw them in jail that will solve the problem.
It has nothing to do with the fact that over 27 percent of black and 26 percent of hispanic people live in poverty. They then make the excuse that they live in poverty because they don't want to work. Of course that's the problem, it clearly has nothing to do with poverty stricken societies receiving low funds to improve education. It clearly has nothing to do with Young ethnic minorities growing up with piss poor education, low funds to improve the society they live in. It has nothing to do with the fact that they grow up feeling like nobody cares about them so why should they give a shit about society and other people. That they have to work three jobs just to survive because of their poor education.
No it's because they're a violent race of people and they need to be thrown in jail.
I fucking hate this conservative blame the victim mentality.
Fuck our infrastructure lets spend trillions of dollars on defense to kill those scary arabs, because our society doesn't need it clearly.
Sorry about my rant I just got so angry listening to my in law. Just when I thought that I could get a long with him.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 25, 2014, 01:52:02 am
Don't feel sorry, I'd be pissed off if my dad said racist bullshit like that too.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on November 25, 2014, 03:50:00 am
Today in post racism America: A mostly white jury decided that a white cop shouldn't see trial for killing an unarmed teenager, who happened to be black.

I wish I could say that I'm surprised.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Tolpuddle Martyr on November 25, 2014, 07:06:49 am
Today in post racism America: A mostly white jury decided that a white cop shouldn't see trial for killing an unarmed teenager, who happened to be black.

I wish I could say that I'm surprised.

I knew this would happen, I knew that the powers that be would pretend the justice system wasn't broken and would appeal for "calm" whilst ignoring any actions on the part of the police to shatter it.

Sometimes it sucks being right.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: RavynousHunter on November 25, 2014, 07:55:37 am
This has probably been building a while, honestly.  I mean, look at the other shit before this: Zimmerman got off with zero charges (to my knowledge), and even the Rodney King trial that sparked the LA Riots back in the 90s didn't lead to much of shit in terms of actual change.  People that want change notice when they don't get it, or when they're given meaningless platitudes in its stead.  People, and not just those directly affected, are rightfully pissed off because, once again, we're being told that, unless you're white, you're not going to get a shred of protection under the law.  This is one of the reasons fucking gangs exist in the first place, and if you piss people off enough, they will eventually break and start to run riot.  Its happened before at many, many points in history, yet folks in power never quite seem to learn the fucking lesson.  This is what happens when you disenfranchise people.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Meshakhad on November 25, 2014, 12:43:07 pm
I'm not convinced that the cop was guilty, but I do feel strongly that they should have indicted. Unless it was blatantly obvious that he was innocent, the case should have gone to trial.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 25, 2014, 01:19:13 pm
I'm not convinced that the cop was guilty, but I do feel strongly that they should have indicted. Unless it was blatantly obvious that he was innocent, the case should have gone to trial.
The kindest spin I can put is Wilson was simply a trigger happy nutcase. Wilson is far bigger and stronger than Brown and possessed several non-lethal means of incapacitation.

Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 25, 2014, 01:21:28 pm
The guy who exposed two rapists now faces 10 years in jail.

The person who exposed war crimes faces 35 years in prison.

The guy who shot an unarmed black teen 6 times won't even get indicted.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on November 25, 2014, 01:44:31 pm
The evidence from the grand jury is gradually being released, so you can find it on Google. A few salient points:

* Wilson claimed that fighting Brown was like fighting "Hulk Hogan" and he fired because he was afraid that Brown would literally kill him by punching him so hard. Wilson's medical records and photographs of his injuries were released and he suffered nothing but minor bruising to the right side of his face, indicative of a fairly weak punch.

* Wilson claimed that Brown, against all logic, charged with his head down like a football player while simultaneously reaching into his waistband for a nonexistent gun.

* Wilson admitted that he shot at Brown as he fled and that Brown had his hands up when he continued shooting.

Also, the National Bar Association is calling bullshit and prepping to bring federal charges. They said that there's no way the (I should point out, almost all white) grand jury failed to get an indictment with the available evidence and witnesses, and they're suspicious about it.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 25, 2014, 02:00:39 pm
Something's rotten in the state of Missouri.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on November 25, 2014, 02:01:29 pm
* Wilson claimed that Brown, against all logic, charged with his head down like a football player while simultaneously reaching into his waistband for a nonexistent gun.

* Wilson admitted that he shot at Brown as he fled and that Brown had his hands up when he continued shooting.

TOTALLY not a contradiction.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: mellenORL on November 25, 2014, 02:41:16 pm
Quote
Wilson admitted that he shot at Brown as he fled and that Brown had his hands up when he continued shooting.


That's the federal case in a nutshell.

Brown was a nasty customer in the convenience store - we all saw the security cam footage of him tussling with the store manager. He was probably anything but polite when the cop told him to get the "fuck outta the middle of the street" later on. But even if Brown DID actually charge back towards Wilson, Wilson had every chance to retreat to the safety of his patrol car, or use a Taser or pepper spray, or simply use his baton. The "he was reaching into his waistband" thing is the standard cop-out for emptying a clip into a suspect.

Teenagers sometimes go through a "I'm a tough guy! Fuck all of you!" stage. It is part of growing up. There should be no excuse to gun down somebody just because they are acting like a bully and an asshole. Yet clearly the grand jury believes that doing any of that while black is justification to be summarily slaughtered.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: RavynousHunter on November 25, 2014, 02:55:10 pm
Hopefully, the feds can bring the son of a bitch to justice.  Assuming an angry mob doesn't get to him first, which it might.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: SCarpelan on November 25, 2014, 03:01:15 pm
Nah, it sounds like the part of Ferguson populated by whites is pretty well protected by the riot police and national guard. It's the area populated by blacks where people are allowed to riot and burn property. Unless the he is suicidal enough to go there he won't be in any danger.

Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: mellenORL on November 25, 2014, 03:05:33 pm
I hear George Zimmerman needs a roommate.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Id82 on November 25, 2014, 03:30:48 pm
I know the kid robbed the store, but something doesn't seem right about the report when they state that Brown charged like a football player to a fully armed officer. It sounds like an excuse. Like shouting "Look out he's coming right for us!" To justify shooting an animal.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 25, 2014, 04:33:41 pm
The kid did not rob any store.  He wasn't even a suspect, just someone who looked like the suspect.  Even then, NOTHING JUSTIFIES THIS!  NOTHING!

The DA decided he didn't want to do shit with this case so he layed everything out to the grand jury.  And I do mean everything.  And then said, "ok so is he guilty or not?  If he isn't, don't bring back a true bill".  He fucking took a dove.  And the National Bar isn't happy.

http://theurbandaily.com/2014/11/25/bar-association-grand-jury-decision/

Ironbite-they're putting together something for the feds to use.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Radiation on November 25, 2014, 05:59:44 pm
Hopefully this will get the feds involved, I just don't think that Wilson should just get off scot free.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ironchew on November 25, 2014, 06:09:44 pm
Unfortunately a federal case has higher standards to meet to be brought to trial. (http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2014/11/25/ferguson-whats-next.html)

Quote
But the burden of proof for bringing federal civil rights charges against Wilson will be much higher than it was in the criminal case. The Justice Department will not only have to demonstrate probable cause, which local prosecutors failed to do, but also that Officer Wilson “willfully” deprived Brown of his civil rights when he fired his gun “under the color of law” – in other words, by acting as a police officer rather than a normal citizen.

Attorney General Holder acknowledged as much in a statement Monday night, stating: “federal civil rights law imposes a high legal bar in these types of cases.” That legal burden has proven difficult to satisfy in similar high profile cases. George Zimmerman, the neighborhood watch volunteer who shot and killed unarmed 17-year-old Trayvon Martin in 2012, has still not been indicted on any federal charges despite an ongoing Justice investigation.

It's possible a federal investigation would get somewhere, but I wouldn't get my hopes up.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 25, 2014, 06:25:32 pm
Higher standards then a DA who really doesn't want to prosecute this case?

Ironbite-so left it all on the Grand Jury to decide guilt or innocence despite that not being their job?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ironchew on November 25, 2014, 06:28:05 pm
Higher standards then a DA who really doesn't want to prosecute this case?

Ironbite-so left it all on the Grand Jury to decide guilt or innocence despite that not being their job?

Higher standards as in this local decision may have been absolute bullshit, but it's unlikely a federal investigation could bring forth charges even if they tried. There's an additional burden of proof involved in civil rights cases.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 25, 2014, 07:36:56 pm
Now for some relatively good news:

(http://oi62.tinypic.com/or11mr.jpg)
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Hoplite on November 25, 2014, 09:40:55 pm
The feds have said that they don't have much of a case.

Well, it isn't as if we already had a foolproof judicial court system. OJ Simpson, Ibid. In my little corner of the US, all shootings by police officers are rubberstamped as "justifiable." It has always been that way and never will change.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Kain on November 25, 2014, 09:50:20 pm
http://www.9news.com.au/world/2014/11/26/12/11/ferguson-cop-declares-he-wouldnt-change-a-thing

Apparently, he feels no remorse over the whole thing. Go figure.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: TheUnknown on November 25, 2014, 10:24:18 pm
http://www.9news.com.au/world/2014/11/26/12/11/ferguson-cop-declares-he-wouldnt-change-a-thing

Apparently, he feels no remorse over the whole thing. Go figure.

Quote from tumbl summarizes my feelings towards this:

Quote
can we just talk about the fact that, regardless of literally every other factor contributing to Mike Brown’s death, the asshole that killed him showed no sympathy, he even went and got married while he was on paid leave because he could not give less of a shit about the fact he took a kid’s life.

any fucking normal person with actual morals that wasn’t a piece of shit would feel fucking bad about killing someone, even if it had been in self defense.

I've heard of people who've been completely justified in killing someone still feeling like shit after doing the deed, because no matter how deserved, the taking of another human life tends to weigh people down.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: KZN02 on November 25, 2014, 11:02:42 pm
The kid did not rob any store.  He wasn't even a suspect, just someone who looked like the suspect.  Even then, NOTHING JUSTIFIES THIS!  NOTHING!
Um, well ... (http://www.ibtimes.com/michael-brown-robbed-convenience-store-stole-cigarillos-darren-wilson-shooting-dorian-1729359)

But that doesn't justify his death.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: mellenORL on November 25, 2014, 11:13:32 pm
Associated Press has compiled PDFs of the evidence shown the grand jury.

http://hosted.ap.org/specials/interactives/_documents/ferguson-shooting/ (http://hosted.ap.org/specials/interactives/_documents/ferguson-shooting/)

Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 26, 2014, 12:09:07 am
Nothing's gonna happen, nothing will ever happen.

Our system has been letting the murder of blacks go unpunished since it was fucking created.
Nothing's gonna change from this and I doubt anything will.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 26, 2014, 12:09:21 am
God bless America.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: R. U. Sirius on November 26, 2014, 12:17:41 am
Turns out that the prosecutor who handled Wilson's case has a history of siding with police and government employees over civilians, even in clear cases of wrongdoing.

http://news.yahoo.com/how-prosecutor-bob-mcculloch-s-controversial-past-is-making-matters-worse-in-ferguson-212622087.html (http://news.yahoo.com/how-prosecutor-bob-mcculloch-s-controversial-past-is-making-matters-worse-in-ferguson-212622087.html)
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Eiki-mun on November 26, 2014, 12:24:35 am
So who's a worse person, Darren Wilson or Bob McCullough? It's honestly a difficult choice. One killed a black teenager and didn't even show a shred of remorse (as was shown by his comments afterwards), and the other, well... just read the article above.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 26, 2014, 01:24:20 am
So who's a worse person, Darren Wilson or Bob McCullough? It's honestly a difficult choice. One killed a black teenager and didn't even show a shred of remorse (as was shown by his comments afterwards), and the other, well... just read the article above.
They both suck so bad it's impossible to tell.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: SpaceProg on November 26, 2014, 01:26:00 am
The plot sickens, it seems.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ghoti on November 26, 2014, 04:08:50 am
A protester in Minneapolis (http://www.ksdk.com/story/news/local/ferguson/2014/11/25/woman-struck-car-protest/70112750/) was struck by a car yesterday afternoon. There's a video of it, but I'm not linking it here - it's easy to find if you really want to see a woman's leg get crushed because she was exercising her First Amendment right to peaceful assembly.

Also, there's been a very surprising discovery about Darren "I'd shoot him again" Wilson: He's a member of the KKK! (http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/anonymous-ferguson-killer-cop-darren-wilson-linked-kkk-ghoul-squad-1475953)

EDIT: if anyone's still not convinced that the police are completely out of control where Ferguson-centered protests are involved, here's some raw footage of an LAPD officer beating a minor with a baton during a peaceful protest. (http://thecityofpaper.tumblr.com/post/103619666218/the-los-angeles-police-department-starting-beating)
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: TheUnknown on November 26, 2014, 04:58:25 am
A protester in Minneapolis (http://www.ksdk.com/story/news/local/ferguson/2014/11/25/woman-struck-car-protest/70112750/) was struck by a car yesterday afternoon. There's a video of it, but I'm not linking it here - it's easy to find if you really want to see a woman's leg get crushed because she was exercising her First Amendment right to peaceful assembly.

Also, there's been a very surprising discovery about Darren "I'd shoot him again" Wilson: He's a member of the KKK! (http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/anonymous-ferguson-killer-cop-darren-wilson-linked-kkk-ghoul-squad-1475953)

EDIT: if anyone's still not convinced that the police are completely out of control where Ferguson-centered protests are involved, here's some raw footage of an LAPD officer beating a minor with a baton during a peaceful protest. (http://thecityofpaper.tumblr.com/post/103619666218/the-los-angeles-police-department-starting-beating)

Quote
According to a statement, the group says it has not published the evidence as it believes it would endanger the life of the person who provided it. Having handed over the evidence, the source emailed, pleading for Anonymous not to publish the information:

"This has gotten out of control. They want to kill you. And after you release this information, they will want to kill me. I am scared for my life right now. I am begging you to please do not release the information that I gave. I'm afraid that because the information I provided is so specific, that it will definitely be traced back to me, and I will be in danger. I am a long time supporter of Anonymous, and have trusted you with my identity. Now I feel my life is in your hands. I'm begging you please. I have a family to think of."

This seems kind of sketchy to me.  We supposedly have information that proves Wilson is with the KKK, but we can't actually see it because the source is too afraid for it to be shown, but not afraid enough to not leak it in the first place.  Something just doesn't sit right.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 26, 2014, 08:43:24 am
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-football/24839556/adrian-peterson-compares-own-indictment-to-ferguson (http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-football/24839556/adrian-peterson-compares-own-indictment-to-ferguson)

As if we didn't already have enough reason to hate Adrian Peterson.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 26, 2014, 10:32:48 am
http://www.startribune.com/local/minneapolis/283891941.html (http://www.startribune.com/local/minneapolis/283891941.html)

Apparently a car ran over some protesters.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Canadian Mojo on November 26, 2014, 06:48:40 pm
Let me preface this by saying I don't know much about the American legal system so I might be way out to lunch with this idea.
I've heard that it would be very difficult or even impossible to build a federal civil rights case against Wilson because of what would need to be proven. On the other hand it seems like it would be pretty damn easy to nail the DA with one or, barring that, some form of prosecutorial misconduct since it is very apparent from what has been released that he was trying to get Wilson a walk.
If the feds were to do this it would invalidate the grand jury's initial decision and since Wilson hasn't been tried or even charged with anything double jeopardy wouldn't apply you should be free to bring in a special prosecutor and start over.

A viable idea or am I out to lunch?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: MadCatTLX on November 26, 2014, 07:12:04 pm
Let me preface this by saying I don't know much about the American legal system so I might be way out to lunch with this idea.
I've heard that it would be very difficult or even impossible to build a federal civil rights case against Wilson because of what would need to be proven. On the other hand it seems like it would be pretty damn easy to nail the DA with one or, barring that, some form of prosecutorial misconduct since it is very apparent from what has been released that he was trying to get Wilson a walk.
If the feds were to do this it would invalidate the grand jury's initial decision and since Wilson hasn't been tried or even charged with anything double jeopardy wouldn't apply you should be free to bring in a special prosecutor and start over.

A viable idea or am I out to lunch?

I'm not entirely sure. I'd bet the DA has enough connections that not shit will happen to him.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 26, 2014, 07:15:32 pm
Civil charges?  Yeah nothing the DA can do about that.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on November 27, 2014, 12:18:51 am
Quote
Wilson admitted that he shot at Brown as he fled and that Brown had his hands up when he continued shooting.


That's the federal case in a nutshell.

Brown was a nasty customer in the convenience store - we all saw the security cam footage of him tussling with the store manager. He was probably anything but polite when the cop told him to get the "fuck outta the middle of the street" later on. But even if Brown DID actually charge back towards Wilson, Wilson had every chance to retreat to the safety of his patrol car, or use a Taser or pepper spray, or simply use his baton. The "he was reaching into his waistband" thing is the standard cop-out for emptying a clip into a suspect.

Teenagers sometimes go through a "I'm a tough guy! Fuck all of you!" stage. It is part of growing up. There should be no excuse to gun down somebody just because they are acting like a bully and an asshole. Yet clearly the grand jury believes that doing any of that while black is justification to be summarily slaughtered.

Wilson actually said in his testimony that he didn't carry a Taser, because it was too uncomfortable.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on November 27, 2014, 02:58:34 am
Quote
Wilson admitted that he shot at Brown as he fled and that Brown had his hands up when he continued shooting.


That's the federal case in a nutshell.

Brown was a nasty customer in the convenience store - we all saw the security cam footage of him tussling with the store manager. He was probably anything but polite when the cop told him to get the "fuck outta the middle of the street" later on. But even if Brown DID actually charge back towards Wilson, Wilson had every chance to retreat to the safety of his patrol car, or use a Taser or pepper spray, or simply use his baton. The "he was reaching into his waistband" thing is the standard cop-out for emptying a clip into a suspect.

Teenagers sometimes go through a "I'm a tough guy! Fuck all of you!" stage. It is part of growing up. There should be no excuse to gun down somebody just because they are acting like a bully and an asshole. Yet clearly the grand jury believes that doing any of that while black is justification to be summarily slaughtered.

Wilson actually said in his testimony that he didn't carry a Taser, because it was too uncomfortable.

Yes, because his comfort is more important that a HUMAN LIFE.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Vypernight on November 27, 2014, 05:33:31 am
While I agree that the verdict is bull****, I think the rioting in the town is uncalled for.  I get it; people are angry.  But are they really helping by setting fire to buildings and looting stores?  Yes, the cop was very VERY wrong, and yes the jury was full of ****.  But by striking out in random directions, especially at innocent people, they seem to be doing nothing but turning more people against them.  At least that what it seems to me.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 27, 2014, 04:33:59 pm
While I agree that the verdict is bull****, I think the rioting in the town is uncalled for.  I get it; people are angry.  But are they really helping by setting fire to buildings and looting stores?  Yes, the cop was very VERY wrong, and yes the jury was full of ****.  But by striking out in random directions, especially at innocent people, they seem to be doing nothing but turning more people against them.  At least that what it seems to me.
Don't have enough insight into the protest to give a response here, could Chit or someone with background knowledge on this help me out here?

I do know the police haven't helped matters by being as aggressive as possible.

Plus it's mostly "calmed" down at this point.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Hoplite on November 27, 2014, 07:13:18 pm
Law Enforcement is getting more and more draconian than ever before. Their newer training courses actually encourage them to draw their firearms, shoot and ask questions later.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/11/26/man-aims-banana-at-deputies_n_6224786.html
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on November 27, 2014, 10:05:48 pm
While I agree that the verdict is bull****, I think the rioting in the town is uncalled for.  I get it; people are angry.  But are they really helping by setting fire to buildings and looting stores?  Yes, the cop was very VERY wrong, and yes the jury was full of ****.  But by striking out in random directions, especially at innocent people, they seem to be doing nothing but turning more people against them.  At least that what it seems to me.

In August, exactly one building got set on fire (a QuikTrip gas station) and 28 businesses reported burglary of some sort, with an estimated total of only about $5 million in damages caused (for comparison, two hailstorms caused about $3.2 billion in damage to St. Louis and the 1992 LA riots caused about $1 billion in damages and 7000 fires started).

The New York Times has reported "at least a dozen" buildings have been set on fire in Ferguson, but I can't find any solid list of what was hit. I do know that at least one police car was set on fire about an hour after the verdict was announced, with witnesses suggesting that a hot burning tear gas grenade fired by the police errantly landed in it. The owner of one car dealership didn't move any of his cars beforehand and supposedly made an insurance claim 2 hours after the fire was set, suggesting that he may have set it on fire himself for the money and hoped to blame it on protesters. Michael Brown Senior's church was set on fire, a typical trademark of the KKK that's quite active in Missouri, as was a charity foundation set up by Antonio French (one of the main protest leaders in the community).

Meanwhile, one person has died. That person is DeAndre Joshua (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/11/26/deandre-joshua-shot-killed-protests_n_6225380.html), a friend of Mike Brown and Dorian Johnson (the guy who was with Brown when he was killed). He was found shot in a burned-out car near where Brown died. He was a small-time neighborhood drug dealer (frankly, I don't think anybody should be condemned to murder for selling weed) and conspiracy theorists are going crazy claiming that he was one of the secret pro-Wilson witnesses being executed by the community for snitching.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 28, 2014, 10:13:13 am
While I agree that the verdict is bull****, I think the rioting in the town is uncalled for.  I get it; people are angry.  But are they really helping by setting fire to buildings and looting stores?  Yes, the cop was very VERY wrong, and yes the jury was full of ****.  But by striking out in random directions, especially at innocent people, they seem to be doing nothing but turning more people against them.  At least that what it seems to me.

In August, exactly one building got set on fire (a QuikTrip gas station) and 28 businesses reported burglary of some sort, with an estimated total of only about $5 million in damages caused (for comparison, two hailstorms caused about $3.2 billion in damage to St. Louis and the 1992 LA riots caused about $1 billion in damages and 7000 fires started).

The New York Times has reported "at least a dozen" buildings have been set on fire in Ferguson, but I can't find any solid list of what was hit. I do know that at least one police car was set on fire about an hour after the verdict was announced, with witnesses suggesting that a hot burning tear gas grenade fired by the police errantly landed in it. The owner of one car dealership didn't move any of his cars beforehand and supposedly made an insurance claim 2 hours after the fire was set, suggesting that he may have set it on fire himself for the money and hoped to blame it on protesters. Michael Brown Senior's church was set on fire, a typical trademark of the KKK that's quite active in Missouri, as was a charity foundation set up by Antonio French (one of the main protest leaders in the community).

Meanwhile, one person has died. That person is DeAndre Joshua (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/11/26/deandre-joshua-shot-killed-protests_n_6225380.html), a friend of Mike Brown and Dorian Johnson (the guy who was with Brown when he was killed). He was found shot in a burned-out car near where Brown died. He was a small-time neighborhood drug dealer (frankly, I don't think anybody should be condemned to murder for selling weed) and conspiracy theorists are going crazy claiming that he was one of the secret pro-Wilson witnesses being executed by the community for snitching.

How bad do you think it'll get?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Alehksunos on November 28, 2014, 02:13:11 pm
Oh boy, I fucking love my family. We've just been through a shit-storm and I was involved. I've even asked my aunt to back-off when she was trying to prove to me that Michael Brown was "a thug and gangster" with an image flipping the bird. I don't even know what to do about it now that I've already made myself look like a close-minded asshole.

I hate being white and I hate it when white people go "I love every people of color and race and yadda-yadda-yadda", all said at the risk of sounding like those frustrated Tumblrs.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: mythbuster43 on November 28, 2014, 02:34:19 pm
Oh boy, I fucking love my family. We've just been through a shit-storm and I was involved. I've even asked my aunt to back-off when she was trying to prove to me that Michael Brown was "a thug and gangster" with an image flipping the bird. I don't even know what to do about it now that I've already made myself look like a close-minded


Because white teenagers never flip the bird or show attitude towards authority figures.[/sarcasm]

Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 28, 2014, 03:59:06 pm
The penalty for flipping the bird in this country is death, why do you not understand?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 29, 2014, 12:25:14 am
Do you think the protests will end up accomplishing jack, fucking, or squat?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: mythbuster43 on November 29, 2014, 12:31:49 am
Do you think the protests will end up accomplishing jack, fucking, or squat?

Yes.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Tolpuddle Martyr on November 29, 2014, 07:05:52 am
The kid did not rob any store.  He wasn't even a suspect, just someone who looked like the suspect.  Even then, NOTHING JUSTIFIES THIS!  NOTHING!

Even if he was a robbery suspect it smells like a furphy to me, something they conveniently inserted into the narrative when prior to that they either didn't have a clue or didn't give a shit.

Call me suspicious I guess.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ghoti on November 29, 2014, 07:18:55 am
The kid did not rob any store.  He wasn't even a suspect, just someone who looked like the suspect.  Even then, NOTHING JUSTIFIES THIS!  NOTHING!

Even if he was a robbery suspect it smells like a furphy to me, something they conveniently inserted into the narrative when prior to that they either didn't have a clue or didn't give a shit.

Call me suspicious I guess.
Oh, it is. The timeline is all wrong (the security footage "proving" Mike's theft is from July), stealing a handful of cigarillos isn't a capitol offense, and no one knows what happened to the "stolen" cigarillos after he exited the store.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 29, 2014, 08:48:11 am
Do you think the protests will end up accomplishing jack, fucking, or squat?

I'm a little more optimistic, because they've attracted international attention.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on November 30, 2014, 08:26:47 am
As expected, Wilson has resigned from the force citing death theats. And about $500k richer.

Ironbite-best pension ever
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 30, 2014, 01:22:06 pm
It's funny, a bank can steal trillions and only get less than one percent of their total profit taken away yet when a black kid allegedly steals 20 bucks from a drugstore he's a thug and deserves to die.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on November 30, 2014, 01:23:09 pm
While I agree that the verdict is bull****, I think the rioting in the town is uncalled for.  I get it; people are angry.  But are they really helping by setting fire to buildings and looting stores?  Yes, the cop was very VERY wrong, and yes the jury was full of ****.  But by striking out in random directions, especially at innocent people, they seem to be doing nothing but turning more people against them.  At least that what it seems to me.

In August, exactly one building got set on fire (a QuikTrip gas station) and 28 businesses reported burglary of some sort, with an estimated total of only about $5 million in damages caused (for comparison, two hailstorms caused about $3.2 billion in damage to St. Louis and the 1992 LA riots caused about $1 billion in damages and 7000 fires started).

The New York Times has reported "at least a dozen" buildings have been set on fire in Ferguson, but I can't find any solid list of what was hit. I do know that at least one police car was set on fire about an hour after the verdict was announced, with witnesses suggesting that a hot burning tear gas grenade fired by the police errantly landed in it. The owner of one car dealership didn't move any of his cars beforehand and supposedly made an insurance claim 2 hours after the fire was set, suggesting that he may have set it on fire himself for the money and hoped to blame it on protesters. Michael Brown Senior's church was set on fire, a typical trademark of the KKK that's quite active in Missouri, as was a charity foundation set up by Antonio French (one of the main protest leaders in the community).

Meanwhile, one person has died. That person is DeAndre Joshua (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/11/26/deandre-joshua-shot-killed-protests_n_6225380.html), a friend of Mike Brown and Dorian Johnson (the guy who was with Brown when he was killed). He was found shot in a burned-out car near where Brown died. He was a small-time neighborhood drug dealer (frankly, I don't think anybody should be condemned to murder for selling weed) and conspiracy theorists are going crazy claiming that he was one of the secret pro-Wilson witnesses being executed by the community for snitching.
Say, could you give a source?
It's not that I don't trust you it's just I'd like to have some evidence I could show others.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Lt. Fred on November 30, 2014, 03:45:11 pm
Do you think the protests will end up accomplishing jack, fucking, or squat?

Nothing has ever been achieved by an American minority except through force.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 30, 2014, 06:28:08 pm
Do you think the protests will end up accomplishing jack, fucking, or squat?

Nothing has ever been achieved by an American minority except through force.

Yeah, because MLK was all about force.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: dpareja on November 30, 2014, 06:39:34 pm
Do you think the protests will end up accomplishing jack, fucking, or squat?

Nothing has ever been achieved by an American minority except through force.

Yeah, because MLK was all about force.

Except that he got a majority to agree with him.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 30, 2014, 07:32:08 pm
Do you think the protests will end up accomplishing jack, fucking, or squat?

Nothing has ever been achieved by an American minority except through force.

Yeah, because MLK was all about force.

Except that he got a majority to agree with him.

Oh.  Sorry, I didn't quite understand what he meant.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Lt. Fred on November 30, 2014, 11:29:05 pm
Do you think the protests will end up accomplishing jack, fucking, or squat?

Nothing has ever been achieved by an American minority except through force.

Yeah, because MLK was all about force.

Sure was. Nonviolent force, sure, but force.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on November 30, 2014, 11:33:03 pm
Do you think the protests will end up accomplishing jack, fucking, or squat?

Nothing has ever been achieved by an American minority except through force.

Yeah, because MLK was all about force.

Sure was. Nonviolent force, sure, but force.

Ah, I get you now.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on December 01, 2014, 08:09:17 pm
So the St. Louis Rams did something really cool this Sunday.  They put their hands up.  Then proceeded to murder the Raiders in what I can only describe as one of the biggest one sided games I've seen that didn't include the Washington Redskins.  But of course some people aren't happy.

Of course those people are the cops who are somewhat confused as to what First Amendment rights give you. (http://www.ksdk.com/story/news/local/2014/11/30/stl-police-officers-association-condemns-rams-display/19721979/)

In an amazing display of stupid, the SLPOA released a statement condeming the 5 Rams players who came out of the tunnel during introductions with their hands up and demanded the NFL fine them and the Rams release a public apology.

Quote
St. Louis, Missouri (November 30, 2014) – The St. Louis Police Officers Association is profoundly disappointed with the members of the St. Louis Rams football team who chose to ignore the mountains of evidence released from the St. Louis County Grand Jury this week and engage in a display that police officers around the nation found tasteless, offensive and inflammatory.
"Five members of the Rams entered the field today exhibiting the "hands-up-don't-shoot" pose that has been adopted by protestors who accused Ferguson Police Officer Darren Wilson of murdering Michael Brown. The gesture has become synonymous with assertions that Michael Brown was innocent of any wrongdoing and attempting to surrender peacefully when Wilson, according to some now-discredited witnesses, gunned him down in cold blood.
"SLPOA Business Manager Jeff Roorda said, "now that the evidence is in and Officer Wilson's account has been verified by physical and ballistic evidence as well as eye-witness testimony, which led the grand jury to conclude that no probable cause existed that Wilson engaged in any wrongdoing, it is unthinkable that hometown athletes would so publicly perpetuate a narrative that has been disproven over-and-over again."
  "Roorda was incensed that the Rams and the NFL would tolerate such behavior and called it remarkably hypocritical. "All week long, the Rams and the NFL were on the phone with the St. Louis Police Department asking for assurances that the players and the fans would be kept safe from the violent protesters who had rioted, looted, and burned buildings in Ferguson. Our officers have been working 12 hour shifts for over a week, they had days off including Thanksgiving cancelled so that they could defend this community from those on the streets that perpetuate this myth that Michael Brown was executed by a brother police officer and then, as the players and their fans sit safely in their dome under the watchful protection of hundreds of St. Louis's finest, they take to the turf to call a now-exonerated officer a murderer, that is way out-of-bounds, to put it in football parlance," Roorda said.
  "The SLPOA is calling for the players involved to be disciplined and for the Rams and the NFL to deliver a very public apology. Roorda said he planned to speak to the NFL and the Rams to voice his organization's displeasure tomorrow. He also plans to reach out to other police organizations in St. Louis and around the country to enlist their input on what the appropriate response from law enforcement should be. Roorda warned, "I know that there are those that will say that these players are simply exercising their First Amendment rights. Well I've got news for people who think that way, cops have first amendment rights too, and we plan to exercise ours. I'd remind the NFL and their players that it is not the violent thugs burning down buildings that buy their advertiser's products. It's cops and the good people of St. Louis and other NFL towns that do. Somebody needs to throw a flag on this play. If it's not the NFL and the Rams, then it'll be cops and their supporters."

NFL has come out and said the players will not be fined and the Rams came out and said the demonstration was not planned and that's it.

Ironbite-just....amazing the hypocrisy coming from the SLPOA
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on December 01, 2014, 09:09:45 pm
While I agree that the verdict is bull****, I think the rioting in the town is uncalled for.  I get it; people are angry.  But are they really helping by setting fire to buildings and looting stores?  Yes, the cop was very VERY wrong, and yes the jury was full of ****.  But by striking out in random directions, especially at innocent people, they seem to be doing nothing but turning more people against them.  At least that what it seems to me.

In August, exactly one building got set on fire (a QuikTrip gas station) and 28 businesses reported burglary of some sort, with an estimated total of only about $5 million in damages caused (for comparison, two hailstorms caused about $3.2 billion in damage to St. Louis and the 1992 LA riots caused about $1 billion in damages and 7000 fires started).

The New York Times has reported "at least a dozen" buildings have been set on fire in Ferguson, but I can't find any solid list of what was hit. I do know that at least one police car was set on fire about an hour after the verdict was announced, with witnesses suggesting that a hot burning tear gas grenade fired by the police errantly landed in it. The owner of one car dealership didn't move any of his cars beforehand and supposedly made an insurance claim 2 hours after the fire was set, suggesting that he may have set it on fire himself for the money and hoped to blame it on protesters. Michael Brown Senior's church was set on fire, a typical trademark of the KKK that's quite active in Missouri, as was a charity foundation set up by Antonio French (one of the main protest leaders in the community).

Meanwhile, one person has died. That person is DeAndre Joshua (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/11/26/deandre-joshua-shot-killed-protests_n_6225380.html), a friend of Mike Brown and Dorian Johnson (the guy who was with Brown when he was killed). He was found shot in a burned-out car near where Brown died. He was a small-time neighborhood drug dealer (frankly, I don't think anybody should be condemned to murder for selling weed) and conspiracy theorists are going crazy claiming that he was one of the secret pro-Wilson witnesses being executed by the community for snitching.
Say, could you give a source?
It's not that I don't trust you it's just I'd like to have some evidence I could show others.
Are you still active? I'd like to be able to link to your source on the amount of actual damage caused by protesters.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: mellenORL on December 02, 2014, 11:04:57 am
Lizard, I believe a google search with the terms August riot damage Ferguson might get part of what you want. As to the latest damage, that is so recent it would be in the early stages of investigation and analysis by the state and local LEO's and the many business and property insurance claims adjustors.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on December 03, 2014, 01:32:53 am
Yeah, I just didn't come for a few days. This (http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/crime-and-courts/ferguson-by-the-numbers/article_5ec448a4-3f08-5861-813c-d03bed1c9784.html) link includes the estimate of the protest damage from August; obviously it's a bit outdated now. I can say that a Google search will utterly fail to find evidence that any protesters set the fires in November. It's a bit of a conspiracy theory thing right now, but this video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B1L_M5yB65o) shows that the Advanced Auto Parts that was set on fire had no protesters around it and it had actually been totally secured by the police shortly before the fires began. Some people are trying to claim that the footage shows the car they're searching on fire and that a flashbang set it off, but it's really obvious bullshit: the "flames" are a reflection of kinda pinkish light and the sound that's supposedly a flashbang detonating is a distant gunshot or grenade, and anyone who's gone shooting would recognize it. There's also no reaction inside the car, which you'd easily get if a flashbang went off because it fucking says "flash" for a reason guys. What I can definitely say with confidence is that the areas that had fires set were very clearly empty of protesters and swarming with police. The only thing that can definitively be said to have been burned by protesters has been American flags, and fuck yeah for that.

Feds are currently probing the arson of Michael Brown Sr.'s church (http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/michael-brown-shooting/feds-probing-arson-michael-brown-sr-s-church-n255961). The pastor himself blames it on white supremacists and it's pointed out that the church was isolated from the rest of the protests and burning buildings, which indicates that it would have been specifically targeted.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on December 03, 2014, 10:32:25 am
The only thing that can definitively be said to have been burned by protesters has been American flags, and fuck yeah for that.
But freeedumsssss!
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on December 03, 2014, 11:12:08 am
The arson of the church is classic KKK intimidation techniques btw.

Ironbite-and there were threats before the riots.

Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: niam2023 on December 03, 2014, 03:09:49 pm
Apparently, those Oathkeeper nutbars have been patrolling Ferguson now, too, just in case you thought the KKK wasn't a crazy enough hard right group.

You may remember them from Cliven Bundy's farm, being a group of solipsistic, obsessive lunatics who believe the government is out to get their guns.

And as of now, they're apparently patrolling buildings on behest of the owners, who they apparently count as "real Americans". I heavily doubt they'd ever patrol a black store owner's house, personally, given the Oathkeepers' pedigree.

They're not good for this situation - its only a matter of time before one of those ex-soldier loons opens fire on another unarmed black teenager.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: R. U. Sirius on December 04, 2014, 03:58:34 pm
http://imgur.com/gallery/fpYzl (http://imgur.com/gallery/fpYzl)

A veteran weighs in on the police response in Ferguson vs. the response of the National Guard deployed there.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on December 05, 2014, 02:37:58 am
http://imgur.com/gallery/fpYzl (http://imgur.com/gallery/fpYzl)

A veteran weighs in on the police response in Ferguson vs. the response of the National Guard deployed there.
Ah good, because when I think "safety" I think "poorly trained nut jobs waving guns in body amour."
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: mellenORL on December 05, 2014, 12:22:12 pm
That vet's picture album and analysis are just excellent. Simultaneous to all the protests going on about the victims, we need protests to also demand de-militarizing all PD's. They need to have their unnecessary toys taken away. Dumping all that military surplus gear and vehicles, etc. on PD's is as lethally stupid as giving race cars to first time drivers.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on December 05, 2014, 01:36:05 pm
That vet's picture album and analysis are just excellent. Simultaneous to all the protests going on about the victims, we need protests to also demand de-militarizing all PD's. They need to have their unnecessary toys taken away. Dumping all that military surplus gear and vehicles, etc. on PD's is as lethally stupid as giving race cars to first time drivers.
Yes.
Why the fuck does every small town PD need high caliber sniper rifles, 100s of assault rifles, and an APC?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: RavynousHunter on December 05, 2014, 02:43:21 pm
That vet's picture album and analysis are just excellent. Simultaneous to all the protests going on about the victims, we need protests to also demand de-militarizing all PD's. They need to have their unnecessary toys taken away. Dumping all that military surplus gear and vehicles, etc. on PD's is as lethally stupid as giving race cars to first time drivers.
Yes.
Why the fuck does every small town PD need high caliber sniper rifles, 100s of assault rifles, and an APC?

How else are you gonna keep those uppity minorities in line?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Dakota Bob on December 05, 2014, 04:24:17 pm
That vet's picture album and analysis are just excellent. Simultaneous to all the protests going on about the victims, we need protests to also demand de-militarizing all PD's. They need to have their unnecessary toys taken away. Dumping all that military surplus gear and vehicles, etc. on PD's is as lethally stupid as giving race cars to first time drivers.
Yes.
Why the fuck does every small town PD need high caliber sniper rifles, 100s of assault rifles, and an APC?

B-but what about AL-QAIDA?!?!
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on December 05, 2014, 04:36:55 pm
That's pretty much what the mindset is.  Al-Qaida, the big bad boogieman, somehow getting on US soil and doing something.  And the cops only have 9 mms and shotguns to deal with them.

Ironbite-hence why a lot of small town police departments have tanks on the equipment list.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on December 05, 2014, 04:44:49 pm
"I don't think we should be using chemical weapons on the Kurds."

"Oh, would you prefer the rebels to win?"
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Lt. Fred on December 06, 2014, 07:13:21 pm
That's pretty much what the mindset is.  Al-Qaida, the big bad boogieman, somehow getting on US soil and doing something.  And the cops only have 9 mms and shotguns to deal with them.

Ironbite-hence why a lot of small town police departments have tanks on the equipment list.

Part of the reason is:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Hollywood_shootout
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on December 06, 2014, 07:18:04 pm
Ok yeah there's that.  Forgot utterly about that.  But the point is 9/11 pushed a lot of PDs to ask for and get surplus military gear.

Ironbite-it just wasn't that big a push after North Hollywood
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: mellenORL on December 06, 2014, 11:55:39 pm
That stuff is dirt cheap and aggressively marketed to PD's - over a decade's worth of surplus from the withdrawal from Iraq and Afghanistan.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on December 07, 2014, 12:28:35 am
That stuff is dirt cheap and aggressively marketed to PD's
Is it, I'd figure that shit must cost a pretty penny to taxpayers.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ironchew on December 07, 2014, 12:39:29 am
That stuff is dirt cheap and aggressively marketed to PD's
Is it, I'd figure that shit must cost a pretty penny to taxpayers.

Just because it's paid for by the public doesn't mean there's no aggressive marketing involved.

See: every war profiteering corporation
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on December 07, 2014, 12:40:41 am
That stuff is dirt cheap and aggressively marketed to PD's
Is it, I'd figure that shit must cost a pretty penny to taxpayers.

Just because it's paid for by the public doesn't mean there's no aggressive marketing involved.

See: every war profiteering corporation
I was talking about the "cheap" part.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: R. U. Sirius on December 07, 2014, 11:23:35 am
http://www.cracked.com/blog/ferguson-eric-garner-why-death-should-outrage-us/?wa_user1=2&wa_user2=News&wa_user3=blog&wa_user4=feature_module (http://www.cracked.com/blog/ferguson-eric-garner-why-death-should-outrage-us/?wa_user1=2&wa_user2=News&wa_user3=blog&wa_user4=feature_module)

An excellent article about why people are reacting to Michael Brown, Eric Garner and other recent deaths the way they are.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Askold on December 07, 2014, 11:45:51 am
I immediately found something I disagree with. Being angry at this injustice and being angry at rioters causing damages at the same time is more likely than the writer thinks.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on December 07, 2014, 01:44:48 pm
I immediately found something I disagree with. Being angry at this injustice and being angry at rioters causing damages at the same time is more likely than the writer thinks.
1. The damaged caused by rioters is around 5million, most of it covered by insurance. And I'm guessing the author was referring to people who have to bring up the riots as a way to distract ("Well, the horrific atrocities committed by policemen who will remain unpunished for their actions is bad and all, but I'm still really upset at the unrest caused by the police in Ferguson acting incredibly aggressive towards a formerly peaceful group of protestors)
2. That has got to be the worst Cracked comment section in a long time, seriously we got "Fucking nigger ape got what he deserved now other nigger apes are mad!" type comments and "But what about the whites??" type comments.
I'm sure I'd see some golden means if I scrolled down some more.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on December 07, 2014, 01:50:15 pm
I like how the normally apolitical dril made a tweet on the issue.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Kain on December 12, 2014, 06:13:59 am
http://gawker.com/undercover-cop-pulls-gun-at-eric-garner-michael-brown-p-1669866054?utm_campaign=socialflow_gawker_facebook&utm_source=gawker_facebook&utm_medium=socialflow

A cop points his gun at protesters in Oakland after he gets outed as undercover.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: TheUnknown on December 12, 2014, 07:02:56 pm
Judge grants Ferguson protesters temporary restraining order against police. (http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/ferguson-protesters-win-injunction-stop-cops-using-tear-gas)

Quote
FERGUSON, Missouri – A federal judge ruled Thursday that police can no longer use tear gas on protesters without declaring an illegal assembly, giving them fair warning and time to vacate the area.

. . .

“Ultimately she decided there was substantial evidence that police had violated the constitutional rights of the protesters, that it was a restriction on their free speech,” Roediger told msnbc shortly after the judge made her ruling.

“The best thing the judge said and she said it a couple of times, was that ‘it’s clear to me for some reason the police are treating this group, around this movement, differently than they treat other large crowds,” Roediger said. “Hopefully it’ll put an end to the practice of protesters having no idea what the police response will be. No more of this sort of punishment in the streets where what the police are going to do is unpredictable and often violent,” he said.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: dpareja on December 12, 2014, 07:23:34 pm
Judge grants Ferguson protesters temporary restraining order against police. (http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/ferguson-protesters-win-injunction-stop-cops-using-tear-gas)

Quote
FERGUSON, Missouri – A federal judge ruled Thursday that police can no longer use tear gas on protesters without declaring an illegal assembly, giving them fair warning and time to vacate the area.

. . .

“Ultimately she decided there was substantial evidence that police had violated the constitutional rights of the protesters, that it was a restriction on their free speech,” Roediger told msnbc shortly after the judge made her ruling.

“The best thing the judge said and she said it a couple of times, was that ‘it’s clear to me for some reason the police are treating this group, around this movement, differently than they treat other large crowds,” Roediger said. “Hopefully it’ll put an end to the practice of protesters having no idea what the police response will be. No more of this sort of punishment in the streets where what the police are going to do is unpredictable and often violent,” he said.

"John Marshall has made his decision; now let him enforce it!"
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on December 12, 2014, 08:25:11 pm
The fact that a judge had to tell them to stop using tear gas without provocation is kinda terrifying.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: R. U. Sirius on December 17, 2014, 09:22:46 pm
http://www.inquisitr.com/1685885/key-ferguson-witness-sandra-mcelroy-faked-entire-testimony-had-lied-to-police-before-report-finds/ (http://www.inquisitr.com/1685885/key-ferguson-witness-sandra-mcelroy-faked-entire-testimony-had-lied-to-police-before-report-finds/)

And now it turns out that one of the key witnesses at the grand jury hearing pulled her entire "eyewitness account" straight out of her ass. Not only that, the prosecutor knew it.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on December 17, 2014, 10:15:21 pm
FIRE HIS ASS NOW AND PRESENT A NEW GRAND JURY WITH THE EVIDENCE!
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cloud3514 on December 18, 2014, 12:23:25 pm
Not only that, the prosecutor knew it.

Considering that the prosecutor was acting like a defense attorney instead of a prosecutor, this doesn't surprise me. At all.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on December 22, 2014, 12:07:11 pm
You know, fifteen years ago, if somebody had told me the LAPD would set a good model for other police departments to follow, I would've laughed in their face.  But things are different now:

http://news.yahoo.com/what-ferguson-can-learn-from-the-lapd-214547339.html (http://news.yahoo.com/what-ferguson-can-learn-from-the-lapd-214547339.html)
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Kain on December 24, 2014, 02:45:54 am
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/12/racist-song-at-ex-cops-charity-event-compares-michael-brown-to-a-roadkill-dog/

Well, would you look at that.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on December 24, 2014, 03:01:57 am
Ever notice how the media will talk about how some white kid who rapes someone or kills a bunch of poeple the media will mention how they were a "good kid" or something but when a black kid gets gunned down they talk about how he once took a selfie of himself pointing a BB gun at the camera or he once smoked pot.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Askold on December 24, 2014, 05:44:27 am
Well, if you listen to racists then whenever a black person dies everyone on news is saying "he didn't do nuffing!" but based on what I've seen at least in US media they don't seem to get much sympathy compared to white suspects.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Lt. Fred on December 24, 2014, 05:44:57 am
http://www.inquisitr.com/1685885/key-ferguson-witness-sandra-mcelroy-faked-entire-testimony-had-lied-to-police-before-report-finds/ (http://www.inquisitr.com/1685885/key-ferguson-witness-sandra-mcelroy-faked-entire-testimony-had-lied-to-police-before-report-finds/)

And now it turns out that one of the key witnesses at the grand jury hearing pulled her entire "eyewitness account" straight out of her ass. Not only that, the prosecutor knew it.

Remember, conservative America as one voice was willing not only to convict a young dead man of being a "thug" (translation: "Nigger", "Jew cockroach", ect) by her sole testimony, but was willing to send the 40-odd contrary witnesses to jail for perjury because they testified otherwise. Coincidentally, they were mostly "thugs" too, and the ones that weren't were "thug-lovers" or else, circularly, they'd have testified otherwise. Funny that.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on December 24, 2014, 10:28:18 am
Hell one of the witnesses was a lying bitch and was still allowed to talk to the grand jury.

Ironbite-this whole shit just shows how much these people value black lives.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: mythbuster43 on December 24, 2014, 09:58:11 pm
Hell one of the witnesses was a lying bitch and was still allowed to talk to the grand jury.

Ironbite-this whole shit just shows how much these people value black lives.

Or lives in general.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on December 29, 2014, 01:25:26 am
Hell one of the witnesses was a lying bitch and was still allowed to talk to the grand jury.

Ironbite-this whole shit just shows how much these people value black lives.

Or lives in general.

But mainly black lives.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on December 29, 2014, 01:26:34 am
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/13/ex-nypd-cop-we-planted-ev_n_1009754.html (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/13/ex-nypd-cop-we-planted-ev_n_1009754.html)

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/12/23/off-duty-black-cops-nypd_n_6373496.html?utm_hp_ref=black-voices&ir=Black%20Voices (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/12/23/off-duty-black-cops-nypd_n_6373496.html?utm_hp_ref=black-voices&ir=Black%20Voices)
Interesting articles.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Cerim Treascair on December 29, 2014, 05:10:47 am
Geezum fuck, those articles are... worrying.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: RavynousHunter on December 29, 2014, 08:31:02 am
Disturbing, but not surprising.  This is what happens with any elite caste, while there are some good eggs, the bastards in their ranks will walk all over anyone deemed beneath them and even those of their own caste that don't fit in.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on January 05, 2015, 07:08:57 pm
Can't let this go now can I?  Big time update

Grand Juror Doe is suing Bob McCulloch over misrepresenting the case (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/01/05/bob-mcculloch-wilson-case_n_6417370.html?ncid=tweetlnkushpmg00000067)

Quote
WASHINGTON -- A member of the grand jury that ultimately decided not to indict former Ferguson, Missouri, Police Officer Darren Wilson in the death of 18-year-old Michael Brown is suing the prosecuting attorney in St. Louis County, accusing Robert McCulloch of mischaracterizing the grand jury process.

The still-anonymous grand juror, referred to only as "Grand Juror Doe" in the lawsuit filed by the American Civil Liberties Union of Missouri, believes that his or her voice "could contribute to the current public dialogue concerning race relations" in the country. The grand juror believes that the Wilson case was handled much differently than the hundreds of other cases presented to the grand jury before the Wilson case.

"From Plaintiff's perspective, the presentation of evidence to the grand jury investigating Wilson differed markedly and in significant ways from how evidence was presented in the hundreds of matters presented to the grand jury earlier in its term," the lawsuit stated. The grand juror believes that the portrayal of the case in the media has not been accurate.

"In Plaintiff's view, the current information available about the grand jurors' views is not entirely accurate -- especially the implication that all grand jurors believed that there was no support for any charges," the lawsuit stated. "Moreover, the public characterization of the grand jurors' view of witnesses and evidence does not accord with Plaintiff's own."

The ACLU said the "life-time gag order" against grand jurors in the case is not fair in the Wilson case because of the extraordinary publicity Brown's death received and the strange way the case was presented.

"The Supreme Court has said that grand jury secrecy must be weighed against the juror's First Amendment rights on a case-by-case basis," ACLU of Missouri Legal Director Tony Rothert said in a statement. "The rules of secrecy must yield because this is a highly unusual circumstance. The First Amendment prevents the state from imposing a life-time gag order in cases where the prosecuting attorney has purported to be transparent."

Oh this is going to be great.  I mean it's gonna suck for McCulloch if they decide this guy has some merits and it will totally change the Grand Jury forever.

Ironbite-the better question is will McCulloch fall on his sword for Wilson?  I think the answer will be no.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on January 10, 2015, 05:21:35 pm
Police throw a hissy fit protest the mayor saying racism exists by slowing down work and only arresting poeple when they have to.
Edit:http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2015/01/09/376174815/new-york-police-commissioner-confirms-work-slowdown-by-officers (http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2015/01/09/376174815/new-york-police-commissioner-confirms-work-slowdown-by-officers)
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: ironbite on January 10, 2015, 06:20:20 pm
And it's back fired so....so badly on them.

Ironbite-almost wish they'd keep this up.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on January 11, 2015, 02:47:58 am
I've read interviews with some of the low-income residents like in Bedford-Stuyvesant, and the general consensus is that the NYPD protest is actually very beneficial to them. The low-level charges the police aren't responding to (public urination, spitting/littering, traffic tickets, loitering, etc.) were all major parts of the extremely racist policing used to harass black and Latino citizens; the myriad regulations strewn throughout NYC for everything from congregating to riding a bicycle on the sidewalk allowed officers to legally stop and harass almost anyone they wanted to. By slowing down arrests and citations (as well as the stop-and-frisk policy), they've inadvertently created the best policing environment New York has had in years.
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: Askold on January 11, 2015, 06:28:38 am
And it's back fired so....so badly on them.

Ironbite-almost wish they'd keep this up.

Like this? https://medium.com/the-nib/lucky-strike-f3c1baa20538
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on January 13, 2015, 02:16:05 am
I've read interviews with some of the low-income residents like in Bedford-Stuyvesant, and the general consensus is that the NYPD protest is actually very beneficial to them. The low-level charges the police aren't responding to (public urination, spitting/littering, traffic tickets, loitering, etc.) were all major parts of the extremely racist policing used to harass black and Latino citizens; the myriad regulations strewn throughout NYC for everything from congregating to riding a bicycle on the sidewalk allowed officers to legally stop and harass almost anyone they wanted to. By slowing down arrests and citations (as well as the stop-and-frisk policy), they've inadvertently created the best policing environment New York has had in years.
So good all around?
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: chitoryu12 on January 14, 2015, 12:05:46 pm
I've read interviews with some of the low-income residents like in Bedford-Stuyvesant, and the general consensus is that the NYPD protest is actually very beneficial to them. The low-level charges the police aren't responding to (public urination, spitting/littering, traffic tickets, loitering, etc.) were all major parts of the extremely racist policing used to harass black and Latino citizens; the myriad regulations strewn throughout NYC for everything from congregating to riding a bicycle on the sidewalk allowed officers to legally stop and harass almost anyone they wanted to. By slowing down arrests and citations (as well as the stop-and-frisk policy), they've inadvertently created the best policing environment New York has had in years.
So good all around?

Pretty much. NYC actually has a very low crime rate for its size, so a lot of the NYPD's efforts go into "quality of life" crimes like people passed out drunk on the sidewalk or prostitution. Unfortunately, the NYPD happens to be extraordinarily racist and shady in a variety of other ways (at least one known prostitute was re-arrested purely because of her clothing being taken as evidence of solicitation (http://www.thefashionlaw.com/woman-arrested-for-her-prostitute-like-clothing/) and another who had no prior criminal record was arrested on the same cause, with condoms being taken as further "evidence" (https://www.vice.com/read/new-york-cops-will-arrest-you-for-carrying-condoms)). Stop-and-frisk has literally been deemed unconstitutional, but it continues with Latino and black men taking almost the entirety of the hit.

There was a man in Brooklyn a few months ago who was suddenly shot and killed by an NYPD officer in some project housing. According to the officers on the scene, it's actually commonplace for them to patrol guns-out in areas with no reported crimes simply to check on the place. The shooter claims that he tried to open a door with his gun hand and accidentally pulled the 12-pound trigger on his regulation-modified pistol. That much is in question. It's not in question that he texted his union representative before doing anything else (http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/brooklyn/exclusive-texted-union-rep-akai-gurley-lay-dying-article-1.2034219).
Title: Re: Ferguson murder
Post by: I am lizard on January 14, 2015, 06:29:38 pm
The carrying guns openly seem fairly genius in an Orwellian way.
Look as intimidating as you can, eventually someone makes a the wrong move and you have him resist arrest multiple times over the head (then maybe "discover" some joints on him).