FSTDT Forums
Community => Politics and Government => Topic started by: CaseAgainstFaith on September 14, 2012, 11:41:31 am
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Obama also has set his definition for "middle class" as families with income of up to $250,000 a year.
Romney's comments came an interview broadcast Friday on ABC's "Good Morning America."
"No one can say my plan is going to raise taxes on middle-income people, because principle number one is (to) keep the burden down on middle-income taxpayers," Romney told host George Stephanopoulos.
"Is $100,000 middle income?" Stephanopoulos asked.
"No, middle income is $200,000 to $250,000," Romney responded.
His campaign later clarified that Romney was referencing household income, not individual income.
The Census Bureau reported this week that the median household income — the midpoint for the nation — is just over $50,000.
Obama wants to extend Bush-era tax cuts for those making less than $250,000, while Romney wants to extend the tax cuts for everyone.
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5hT1nGNyd4JyixXboBO_c3Pvfj7yQ?docId=b1d66e74fd9947c59bb49883826cfe9d (http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5hT1nGNyd4JyixXboBO_c3Pvfj7yQ?docId=b1d66e74fd9947c59bb49883826cfe9d)
So I guess if you make less than 200k in Romney's eyes you're a poor SOB.
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I hope the Obama campaign is listening to all this privileged, utterly out-of-touch nonsense and recording it to play back endlessly, no commentary or explanation required. It speaks for itself.
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How out of touch with reality can you get seriously?
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Okay...I'm pretty sure I was raised middle-class, and I don't think I've met anyone who meets even the lowest of Romney's standards for middle class.
I never knew I was poor white trash... *starts dressing in wifebeaters and jeans, finds a rusty car engine to put in his front yard and marries his cousin*
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You make suits out of the skins of wife-beating assholes, too? Yaaaaaaaaaaay!
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You make suits out of the skins of wife-beating assholes, too? Yaaaaaaaaaaay!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleeveless_shirt#A-shirt (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleeveless_shirt#A-shirt)
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Huh. I just went from lower middle class to poor. Well, how about that.
Oh, and Rupurt, there's a difference between poor and redneck.
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You make suits out of the skins of wife-beating assholes, too? Yaaaaaaaaaaay!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleeveless_shirt#A-shirt (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleeveless_shirt#A-shirt)
(http://socalmountains.com/e107_files/public/1345239693_504_FT171692_foghorn-leghorn-thats-a-joke-son-you-missed-it-flew-right-by-ya.jpg)
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Huh. I just went from lower middle class to poor. Well, how about that.
Oh, and Rupurt, there's a difference between poor and redneck.
Fantastic, I'm now officially poor, too.
Romney, you're an ass.
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Romney, could you be more of a stereotypical rich, white guy? This cracker doesn't get shit.
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Rupert, Zachski, want to come over tonight? We can whip up some ramens and bust out the Mad Dog 20 20 (purple of course) and then get off our lazy asses to cash out thousands of dollars worth of government welfare checks. It'll be a hoot. Anyone else who's poor, c'mon! More the merrier!
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So... wow.
I didn't know I was lower class, even with two college grads working in computing contributing to the household. Does this mean no one can ask me to wear dress shoes anymore?
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I guess we're living in poverty between me and my roomie making a combined... about 70 K annually. A smidge more than that.
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Rupert, Zachski, want to come over tonight? We can whip up some ramens and bust out the Mad Dog 20 20 (purple of course) and then get off our lazy asses to cash out thousands of dollars worth of government welfare checks. It'll be a hoot. Anyone else who's poor, c'mon! More the merrier!
Nah, nah. Gotta go for Colt 45 or Mickey's Bombers.
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I dunno... I'm a bit high-falutin' when it comes to my malt liquor... I prefer King Cobra.
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Well, this means that my family went from"dirt poor" to just "regular-style poor".
I dunno... I'm a bit high-falutin' when it comes to my malt liquor... I prefer King Cobra.
>2012
>Not drinking Steel Reserve
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Romney, could you be more of a stereotypical rich, white guy? This cracker doesn't get shit.
Seriously.
Even here in Canada, where incomes tend to be slightly higher on average, 200-250K would be well above middle class.
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Damn, guys. I know we're all poor, but let's try and have some class.I figured if company's coming I'll serve something close to wine instead of something close to beer.
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You want redneck alcohol? The S guy I mentioned in my F&B thread has an uncle who's an moonshiner. If you don't want something made in a vat in the woods that might have a dead squirrel in with it's skin falling off from decomposition, them you should go with Bud Light or Natty Ice. Some might say go with PBR, but I don't know of anyone that drinks that 'round these here parts.
*Goes back to playing dueling banjos SCIENCE! style*
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ovcwnBaOMI
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YAY I'M DIRT POOR NOW!
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Maybe I read it wrong, but the first post also mentioned:
Obama also has set his definition for "middle class" as families with income of up to $250,000 a year.
Which is well above the median income.
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You forgot a word. He said up to. I think his middle class income starts out at around the median and then goes up.
Ironbite-bit of a difference there.
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You forgot a word. He said up to. I think his middle class income starts out at around the median and then goes up.
Ironbite-bit of a difference there.
You think his middle class starts there, but does it? Maybe it does, maybe you just put Obama on a pedestal. Romneys middle class is up to 250k too.
But does Romney really believe that? I mean, that would explain a lot, if he thinks the average Joe has 200k at his disposal.
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Are we reading the same things? Cause Romney said that his middle class starts at 200k. And ends 50k later.
Ironbite-and I do believe I remember Obama saying the middle class ends at 250k so....yeah.
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His campaign later clarified that Romney was referencing household income, not individual income.
I sure hope they do not really thing this clarification made anything better.
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Are we reading the same things? Cause Romney said that his middle class starts at 200k. And ends 50k later.
Ironbite-and I do believe I remember Obama saying the middle class ends at 250k so....yeah.
Well, I said Romneys middle class is up to 250k.
You say it starts at 200k and ends 50k later. My math could be off a little bit, but I was sure that would sum up to 250k.
So, Obamas and Romneys middle class end at the same point, and I have not seen where Obamas starts. Just sayin'
Of course I could just misinterpret your post. In that case, I'm sorry.
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You forgot a word. He said up to. I think his middle class income starts out at around the median and then goes up.
Ironbite-bit of a difference there.
Obama never mentioned his lower end of the scale, it could easily be $200,000. Anyway, at least Romney is more honest about the fact that he hates the working class.
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Are we reading the same things? Cause Romney said that his middle class starts at 200k. And ends 50k later.
Ironbite-and I do believe I remember Obama saying the middle class ends at 250k so....yeah.
Well, I said Romneys middle class is up to 250k.
You say it starts at 200k and ends 50k later. My math could be off a little bit, but I was sure that would sum up to 250k.
So, Obamas and Romneys middle class end at the same point, and I have not seen where Obamas starts. Just sayin'
Of course I could just misinterpret your post. In that case, I'm sorry.
....The point isn't the top. The point is the bottom.
So Obama and Romney think that $250k is the upper limit of the middle class. May not be accurate, but that's not bad in and of itself.
Romney, however, says the middle class begins at $200k, which is blatantly a falsehood. Obama hasn't said one way or the other, but his figure is probably much, much lower considering the fact that Obama has shown himself to be closer in touch with reality than Romney has.
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Romney, however, says the middle class begins at $200k, which is blatantly a falsehood.
True, it has nothing to do with income.
Obama hasn't said one way or the other, but his figure is probably much, much lower considering the fact that Obama has shown himself to be closer in touch with reality than Romney has.
Hah, I wouldn't make any guesses either way. Obama is as much an enemy of the workers as is Romney. It's just that Obama is very good at talking left.
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You want redneck alcohol? The S guy I mentioned in my F&B thread has an uncle who's an moonshiner. If you don't want something made in a vat in the woods that might have a dead squirrel in with it's skin falling off from decomposition, them you should go with Bud Light or Natty Ice. Some might say go with PBR, but I don't know of anyone that drinks that 'round these here parts.
*Goes back to playing dueling banjos SCIENCE! style*
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ovcwnBaOMI
Fuck that. House of the Rising Sun, bitches.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hgll-XTqcS4
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Can you imagine how unbelievably loud that would be? It's LIGHTNING.
The bottom 20% of Americans are poor. The next 20% are lower-middle income. The next 20% are middle. The next 20% are upper-middle. The rest are wealthy.
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...shit, I'm poor now.
(http://i1.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/389/431/bfa.jpg)
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Romney, however, says the middle class begins at $200k, which is blatantly a falsehood.
True, it has nothing to do with income.
Obama hasn't said one way or the other, but his figure is probably much, much lower considering the fact that Obama has shown himself to be closer in touch with reality than Romney has.
Hah, I wouldn't make any guesses either way. Obama is as much an enemy of the workers as is Romney. It's just that Obama is very good at talking left.
(http://cdn.front.moveon.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/AmericanJobsAct400X-400x300.jpg)
Wanna try again?
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Boo hoo, Obama is so left -wing, he bends over backwards for the Republicans and is in the Democrat party. Didn't you know that liberals voted for him? And the CPUSA! Gosh, he must be a lefty, almost FDR, Ghandi and Marx rolled into one.
He doesn't hire neo-liberals. (http://archive.truthout.org/121708R)
He would never attack Medicare (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/01/15/AR2009011504114.html?sid=ST2009011504146) and Social Security. (http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2011/07/so-what-might-happen-if-we-get-to-august-3-with-no-deficit-deal.html)
He is a big friend (http://www.salon.com/2012/08/14/secrecy_creep/) to whistleblowers. (http://www.salon.com/2012/02/09/obamas_unprecedented_war_on_whistleblowers/)
Totally not against people working for free. (http://exiledonline.com/huffpo-america-from-arianna-huffington%E2%80%99s-unpaid-massage-therapists-to-obama%E2%80%99s-bridge-to-work-program/)
Wants to hold bankers accountable. (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/08/criminal-charges-wall-street_n_1857926.html?placeValuesBeforeTB_=savedValues&KeepThis=true&TB_iframe=true&height=550&width=980)
Really, the bankers hate him. (http://wallstreetonparade.com/2012/09/who-says-wall-streets-not-backing-obama/?placeValuesBeforeTB_=savedValues&KeepThis=true&TB_iframe=true&height=550&width=980)
Timothy Geithner (http://exiledonline.com/are-obama-and-geithner-the-twins-from-hell/) and Larry Summers (http://exiledonline.com/is-larry-summers-taking-kickbacks-from-the-banks-hes-bailing-out/) are not on his economic team. Not at all.
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*breaks out the popcorn*
This'll be in F&B in three posts...
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Boo hoo, Obama is so left -wing, he bends over backwards for the Republicans and is in the Democrat party. Didn't you know that liberals voted for him? And the CPUSA! Gosh, he must be a lefty, almost FDR, Ghandi and Marx rolled into one.
He doesn't hire neo-liberals. (http://archive.truthout.org/121708R)
He would never attack Medicare (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/01/15/AR2009011504114.html?sid=ST2009011504146) and Social Security. (http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2011/07/so-what-might-happen-if-we-get-to-august-3-with-no-deficit-deal.html)
He is a big friend (http://www.salon.com/2012/08/14/secrecy_creep/) to whistleblowers. (http://www.salon.com/2012/02/09/obamas_unprecedented_war_on_whistleblowers/)
Totally not against people working for free. (http://exiledonline.com/huffpo-america-from-arianna-huffington%E2%80%99s-unpaid-massage-therapists-to-obama%E2%80%99s-bridge-to-work-program/)
Wants to hold bankers accountable. (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/08/criminal-charges-wall-street_n_1857926.html?placeValuesBeforeTB_=savedValues&KeepThis=true&TB_iframe=true&height=550&width=980)
Really, the bankers hate him. (http://wallstreetonparade.com/2012/09/who-says-wall-streets-not-backing-obama/?placeValuesBeforeTB_=savedValues&KeepThis=true&TB_iframe=true&height=550&width=980)
Timothy Geithner (http://exiledonline.com/are-obama-and-geithner-the-twins-from-hell/) and Larry Summers (http://exiledonline.com/is-larry-summers-taking-kickbacks-from-the-banks-hes-bailing-out/) are not on his economic team. Not at all.
Not that I'm disagreeing with the notion of Obama being a conservative in progressive's clothing, but honestly what is this in response to? Seems rather random for a thread about Mitt Romney.
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He's responding to Ironbite
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Bahahaha. I just love how this guy keeps saying stupid thing after stupid thing. I hope he keeps it up, it'll hopefully lower his chances of being elected..
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Boo hoo, Obama is so left -wing, he bends over backwards for the Republicans and is in the Democrat party. Didn't you know that liberals voted for him? And the CPUSA! Gosh, he must be a lefty, almost FDR, Ghandi and Marx rolled into one.
He doesn't hire neo-liberals. (http://archive.truthout.org/121708R)
He would never attack Medicare (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/01/15/AR2009011504114.html?sid=ST2009011504146) and Social Security. (http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2011/07/so-what-might-happen-if-we-get-to-august-3-with-no-deficit-deal.html)
He is a big friend (http://www.salon.com/2012/08/14/secrecy_creep/) to whistleblowers. (http://www.salon.com/2012/02/09/obamas_unprecedented_war_on_whistleblowers/)
Totally not against people working for free. (http://exiledonline.com/huffpo-america-from-arianna-huffington%E2%80%99s-unpaid-massage-therapists-to-obama%E2%80%99s-bridge-to-work-program/)
Wants to hold bankers accountable. (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/08/criminal-charges-wall-street_n_1857926.html?placeValuesBeforeTB_=savedValues&KeepThis=true&TB_iframe=true&height=550&width=980)
Really, the bankers hate him. (http://wallstreetonparade.com/2012/09/who-says-wall-streets-not-backing-obama/?placeValuesBeforeTB_=savedValues&KeepThis=true&TB_iframe=true&height=550&width=980)
Timothy Geithner (http://exiledonline.com/are-obama-and-geithner-the-twins-from-hell/) and Larry Summers (http://exiledonline.com/is-larry-summers-taking-kickbacks-from-the-banks-hes-bailing-out/) are not on his economic team. Not at all.
Ahh good you cited sources. At least you have good solid reasons for your distaste for Obama.
Ironbite-now give me some good reasons why you hate Romney.
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Boo hoo, Obama is so left -wing, he bends over backwards for the Republicans and is in the Democrat party. Didn't you know that liberals voted for him? And the CPUSA! Gosh, he must be a lefty, almost FDR, Ghandi and Marx rolled into one.
He doesn't hire neo-liberals. (http://archive.truthout.org/121708R)
He would never attack Medicare (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/01/15/AR2009011504114.html?sid=ST2009011504146) and Social Security. (http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2011/07/so-what-might-happen-if-we-get-to-august-3-with-no-deficit-deal.html)
He is a big friend (http://www.salon.com/2012/08/14/secrecy_creep/) to whistleblowers. (http://www.salon.com/2012/02/09/obamas_unprecedented_war_on_whistleblowers/)
Totally not against people working for free. (http://exiledonline.com/huffpo-america-from-arianna-huffington%E2%80%99s-unpaid-massage-therapists-to-obama%E2%80%99s-bridge-to-work-program/)
Wants to hold bankers accountable. (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/08/criminal-charges-wall-street_n_1857926.html?placeValuesBeforeTB_=savedValues&KeepThis=true&TB_iframe=true&height=550&width=980)
Really, the bankers hate him. (http://wallstreetonparade.com/2012/09/who-says-wall-streets-not-backing-obama/?placeValuesBeforeTB_=savedValues&KeepThis=true&TB_iframe=true&height=550&width=980)
Timothy Geithner (http://exiledonline.com/are-obama-and-geithner-the-twins-from-hell/) and Larry Summers (http://exiledonline.com/is-larry-summers-taking-kickbacks-from-the-banks-hes-bailing-out/) are not on his economic team. Not at all.
Ahh good you cited sources. At least you have good solid reasons for your distaste for Obama.
Ironbite-now give me some good reasons why you hate Romney.
>implying that the reasons to hate Romney are not self-evident
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He's responding to Ironbite
Gotcha.
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Ironbite-now give me some good reasons why you hate Romney.
Him being a huge capitalist, neo-liberal and the presidential contender for the Republican party is not enough?
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Ironbite-now give me some good reasons why you hate Romney.
Him being a huge capitalist, neo-liberal and the presidential contender for the Republican party is not enough?
(bolded for emphasis)
(http://techredible.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/You-keep-using-that-word1-300x252.jpg)
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(bolded for emphasis)
(http://techredible.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/You-keep-using-that-word1-300x252.jpg)
Orly? How so?
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Ironbite-now give me some good reasons why you hate Romney.
Him being a huge capitalist, neo-liberal and the presidential contender for the Republican party is not enough?
(bolded for emphasis)
(http://techredible.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/You-keep-using-that-word1-300x252.jpg)
Doesn't a neoliberal generally believe in deregulation and privatization in order to allow the private sector to, more or less, get away with whatever it wants? That certainly sounds like Rmoney.
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Ironbite-now give me some good reasons why you hate Romney.
Him being a huge capitalist, neo-liberal and the presidential contender for the Republican party is not enough?
(bolded for emphasis)
(http://techredible.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/You-keep-using-that-word1-300x252.jpg)
Doesn't a neoliberal generally believe in deregulation and privatization in order to allow the private sector to, more or less, get away with whatever it wants? That certainly sounds like Rmoney.
That sounds to me like the whole of the Teabaggers and the Republican Party at large. Are they liberals now? Do I have to start calling myself neo-conservative because I think regulation and government oversight can be a good thing?
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They mean liberalism in terms of lazifarrie
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No, neo-conservatism is neo-liberalism with military based imperialism. Using the term liberal to mean someone who is somewhat left-wing and a supporter of government intervention is a new American invention. Liberalism has traditionally meant freedom from government, economic and social. The liberal parties in Europe and Australia are therefore right-wing parties as they came from the classical liberal tradition (if they are or not is up for debate, e.g. Howard and Abbott).
The Tea Party are a mix between neo- and paleo-conservatives. The Republicans, like many right-wing parties are a mix of groups, loosely bound together by the fact they represent the more conservative elements of the bourgeoisie.
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Classical liberals were not reflexively anti-government action as modern conservatives are.
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Modern conservatives aren't reflexively anti-government either, they will support whenever it supports their interests.
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Modern conservatives aren't reflexively anti-government either, they will support whenever it supports their interests.
See the obscenely bloated defense budget for details.
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Ironbite-now give me some good reasons why you hate Romney.
Him being a huge capitalist, neo-liberal and the presidential contender for the Republican party is not enough?
(bolded for emphasis)
(http://techredible.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/You-keep-using-that-word1-300x252.jpg)
Doesn't a neoliberal generally believe in deregulation and privatization in order to allow the private sector to, more or less, get away with whatever it wants? That certainly sounds like Rmoney.
Isn't that the textbook definition of a libertarian?
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Ironbite-now give me some good reasons why you hate Romney.
Him being a huge capitalist, neo-liberal and the presidential contender for the Republican party is not enough?
(bolded for emphasis)
(http://techredible.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/You-keep-using-that-word1-300x252.jpg)
Doesn't a neoliberal generally believe in deregulation and privatization in order to allow the private sector to, more or less, get away with whatever it wants? That certainly sounds like Rmoney.
Isn't that the textbook definition of a libertarian?
Well, neoliberalism is an economic philosophy and libertarianism encompasses more than just economics.
According to the ever-reliable Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoliberalism):
Neoliberalism is a label for economic liberalizations, free trade and open markets. Neoliberalism supports the privatization of nationalized industries, deregulation, and enhancing the role of the private sector in modern society.
Ideally, a libertarian (in the U.S. anyway) is someone with conservative economic views and liberal social views. (With conservative and liberal in this case having their modern connotations.)
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Aah, and here I was thinking it was just another meaningless political buzzword.
Also, see: economic disaster.
(By tha way, not being snide...too tired to be snide.)
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/me is getting a political headache.
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Isn't that the textbook definition of a libertarian?
The funny thing is that libertarian used to refer to anarchists.
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Isn't that the textbook definition of a libertarian?
The funny thing is that libertarian used to refer to anarchists.
Pretty sure Noam Chomsky refers to himself as a left libertarian ^_^
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/me is getting a political headache.
Though this is a wonderful point to bring up my 'pointless labels' annoyance again.
Obama is as liberal as could possibly get elected in this country, if that isn't good enough for you change the fucking country. Just because someone doesn't torch the existing order and put his enemies heads on spikes doesn't mean they aren't liberal, it means they realize that actual change takes time.
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/me is getting a political headache.
Though this is a wonderful point to bring up my 'pointless labels' annoyance again.
Obama is as liberal as could possibly get elected in this country, if that isn't good enough for you change the fucking country. Just because someone doesn't torch the existing order and put his enemies heads on spikes doesn't mean they aren't liberal, it means they realize that actual change takes time.
Whoa :D
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/me is getting a political headache.
Though this is a wonderful point to bring up my 'pointless labels' annoyance again.
Obama is as liberal as could possibly get elected in this country, if that isn't good enough for you change the fucking country. Just because someone doesn't torch the existing order and put his enemies heads on spikes doesn't mean they aren't liberal, it means they realize that actual change takes time.
Obama the candidate was well to the left of Obama the president. I don't think anyone would be complaining if he'd just achieved the ideological promise of his campaign. A more centrist president than Obama was indeed recently elected; Barack Obama. And he'll probably be reelected on that same ideological grounds, before charging back to neo-liberalism, Gingritchcare and the rest.
Typically, conservative Democratic Presidents (Clinton, Obama, Carter) are less popular than liberal ones (Early LBJ, Kennedy, FDR).
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Last time I checked Clinton is still very popular.
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Obama is as liberal as could possibly get elected in this country, if that isn't good enough for you change the fucking country. Just because someone doesn't torch the existing order and put his enemies heads on spikes doesn't mean they aren't liberal, it means they realize that actual change takes time.
A) I'm not a liberal,
B) Obama is not a liberal. America has voted presidents who have been much further to the left than Obama. If this is as far left they will vote, and as Lt. Fred said, Obama the campaigner talked very (relatively) left-wing,
C) I never expected Obama to be a revolutionary, and liberals aren't revolutionaries,
D) What do you mean by change the country?
E) Actual change can also happen damned quickly.