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Community => Society and History => Topic started by: Askold on December 14, 2015, 03:34:56 am

Title: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: Askold on December 14, 2015, 03:34:56 am
http://www.addictinginfo.org/2015/12/13/kentucky-christian-homeless-shelter-just-banned-women-and-girls-because-the-bible-video/

Kentucky homeless shelter decided to throw out the women (and girls) because they are a "Good Christian (tm)"  organization and were afraid of the people in the shelter having pre-marital sex.

Quote
    “They may want to meet or even slip in a room occasionally and then we can’t have that. It seem like these last days it’s getting worse. Ungodly time.”

...

“I don’t know if what’s happening, uh, if it’s a whole because they know it’s a men and women’s shelter, they say, ‘well, we’re homeless — maybe we can find somebody, a mate or something,” he explained, adding that “if they done it right, they’d be fine but they go overboard with it.” Woodward did not explain how they could “done it right.”

At least the women weren't just thrown out on the streets. They were moved to a shelter 30minutes away and the director hopes to let women into the shelter again as soon as the place has been renovated so that this kind of shenanigans can be prevented. (No idea how they think they will accomplish that.) Also, majority of the people in the shelter were men so it is plausible that had the gender ration been the other way round the shelter would have kicked the men out.

And a final quote because I honestly can't think of a better joke:
Quote
Of course, he did not address the possibility of hot, steamy man-on-man sex or “solo play” — because the problem, obviously, is the female population.
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: mellenORL on December 14, 2015, 08:56:13 am
Woodward should go ahead and ban the men, too. And himself. He has no business running a shelter if he's that fucking stupid. A better use of the shelter would be an open squat rather than him running it.
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: ironbite on December 14, 2015, 06:58:32 pm
......holy fuck I thought people like this didn't run actual places.
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: Thejebusfire on December 14, 2015, 07:08:25 pm
It's nice they had another shelter to take them in.
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: Art Vandelay on December 14, 2015, 07:17:22 pm
How is it that people are still hung up about premarital sex in 2015?
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on December 14, 2015, 07:22:02 pm
How is it that people are still hung up about premarital sex in 2015?

I have some theories.
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: Sigmaleph on December 14, 2015, 07:55:09 pm
How is it that people are still hung up about premarital sex in 2015?

I have some theories.

I'm curious to hear them.
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: Art Vandelay on December 14, 2015, 09:27:43 pm
How is it that people are still hung up about premarital sex in 2015?

I have some theories.
...Good to know?
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: pyro on December 14, 2015, 09:35:14 pm
Meh, could've been way worse.
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: davedan on December 14, 2015, 09:47:54 pm
How is it that people are still hung up about premarital sex in 2015?

I have some theories.
...Good to know?

That is good to know I only have untested hypotheses.
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on December 14, 2015, 09:50:59 pm
How is it that people are still hung up about premarital sex in 2015?

I have some theories.
...Good to know?

That is good to know I only have untested hypotheses.

Well-played.
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: TheL on December 15, 2015, 12:40:24 pm
I guess Matthew 25 was missing from their Bibles.
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: Ironchew on December 15, 2015, 12:57:16 pm
How is it that people are still hung up about premarital sex in 2015?

I have some theories.

Direct question, UP (well, more of a direct request):

I'm interested in these theories you mentioned. Explain your best one to us.
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on December 15, 2015, 01:07:30 pm
How is it that people are still hung up about premarital sex in 2015?

I have some theories.

Direct question, UP (well, more of a direct request):

I'm interested in these theories you mentioned. Explain your best one to us.

I think my best one is that it's an extension of the unfortunate human tendency to look down on those they consider inferior.  There are always those considered less deserving than others, whether it be "lazy bums" who don't deserve monetary aid or "bigots" who don't deserve free speech rights.  Really, I'd say that's the root cause, when you get right down to it.
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: davedan on December 15, 2015, 04:00:46 pm
How is it that people are still hung up about premarital sex in 2015?

I have some theories.

Direct question, UP (well, more of a direct request):

I'm interested in these theories you mentioned. Explain your best one to us.

I think my best one is that it's an extension of the unfortunate human tendency to look down on those they consider inferior.  There are always those considered less deserving than others, whether it be "lazy bums" who don't deserve monetary aid or "bigots" who don't deserve free speech rights.  Really, I'd say that's the root cause, when you get right down to it.

But why are people who have sex before marriage considered inferior? Or are you saying that the issue isn't sex before marriage so much as sex before marriage for the homeless?
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on December 15, 2015, 04:13:49 pm
How is it that people are still hung up about premarital sex in 2015?

I have some theories.

Direct question, UP (well, more of a direct request):

I'm interested in these theories you mentioned. Explain your best one to us.

I think my best one is that it's an extension of the unfortunate human tendency to look down on those they consider inferior.  There are always those considered less deserving than others, whether it be "lazy bums" who don't deserve monetary aid or "bigots" who don't deserve free speech rights.  Really, I'd say that's the root cause, when you get right down to it.

But why are people who have sex before marriage considered inferior? Or are you saying that the issue isn't sex before marriage so much as sex before marriage for the homeless?

Because certain people view those who engage in premarital sex as degenerates.
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: davedan on December 15, 2015, 04:16:11 pm
How is it that people are still hung up about premarital sex in 2015?

I have some theories.

Direct question, UP (well, more of a direct request):

I'm interested in these theories you mentioned. Explain your best one to us.

I think my best one is that it's an extension of the unfortunate human tendency to look down on those they consider inferior.  There are always those considered less deserving than others, whether it be "lazy bums" who don't deserve monetary aid or "bigots" who don't deserve free speech rights.  Really, I'd say that's the root cause, when you get right down to it.

But why are people who have sex before marriage considered inferior? Or are you saying that the issue isn't sex before marriage so much as sex before marriage for the homeless?

Because certain people view those who engage in premarital sex as degenerates.

Is this going to be one of those circular conversations?

That was Art's original question. Why do people still think there is something wrong with premarital sex? Why is it considered degenerate?
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: Askold on December 15, 2015, 04:25:24 pm
I hope you guys do realize that UP isn't claiming that premarital sex makes you a degenerate, he is just saying that people apparently still think that.
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: davedan on December 15, 2015, 04:30:28 pm
Thanks for the mastery of the obvious Askold.
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: Askold on December 15, 2015, 04:32:39 pm
Thanks for the mastery of the obvious Askold.
No problem good citizen! Just let me know if you have further trouble with simple matters.

CAPTAIN OBVIOUS AWAYYYYY!!

(http://cdn.meme.am/instances/15357179.jpg)
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: Ultimate Paragon on December 15, 2015, 04:51:14 pm
I don't know, but I heard a theory that the taboo came about because of STDs.
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: Even Then on December 15, 2015, 05:03:47 pm
Or maybe these people think that monogamic marriage is the way God intended, and having sex outside of it is disgusting because it defiles that?
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: guizonde on December 15, 2015, 05:05:14 pm
maybe it's both: christians look down on premarital sex, people look down on the homeless. take a christian, and he'll do both. thus, the root cause is prejudice against those who are different than you.

as for why... well, it's easier to hate irrationnally than to understand. it doesn't challenge you as much.

concerning why people think premarital sex is evil, i'd say blame abrahamic religions for that one. check out pagan, deist, and non-abrahamic religious rituals and you'll find a lot of sex in there. besides bacchus, i know of the vestals, some hindu rituals, amazonian fertility dances, hieros gamos, and even the pharaohs had to whack off into the nile ceremonially to guarantee a bountiful harvest (pharaoh = living god, giving his seed into the life-giving nile). sex is demonized only in western religions since the advent of christianity. before that, jews weren't numerous or powerful enough to have an impact.

also, not talking about roman orgies. there was very little religiosity about those, just massive parties where excess and hedonism were the only goal.
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: Askold on December 15, 2015, 05:07:47 pm
I assume that the taboo came because of children being born out of wedlock. Go back several centuries and in much of the world if an unmarried woman got pregnant she was much less likely to find a suitor and raising the child and supporting her would be the responsibility of her family (if she didn't simply get disowned.) And with less chances of employment or welfare, raising kids on your own wasn't that easy either.

Nowadays in most countries single mother can actually get jobs and/or raise a child on her own and it is much less of a horrible stain to marry someone (particularly a woman) who already has kids. But I suppose some folks are still old fashioned.

EDIT: Of course contraceptives are also better these days so accidental pregnancies are rarer as well. (with proper/poor sex education being one of the biggest factors in that.)
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: Sigmaleph on December 15, 2015, 09:53:21 pm
I don't know, but I heard a theory that the taboo came about because of STDs.
I assume that the taboo came because of children being born out of wedlock. Go back several centuries and in much of the world if an unmarried woman got pregnant she was much less likely to find a suitor and raising the child and supporting her would be the responsibility of her family (if she didn't simply get disowned.) And with less chances of employment or welfare, raising kids on your own wasn't that easy either.

Nowadays in most countries single mother can actually get jobs and/or raise a child on her own and it is much less of a horrible stain to marry someone (particularly a woman) who already has kids. But I suppose some folks are still old fashioned.

EDIT: Of course contraceptives are also better these days so accidental pregnancies are rarer as well. (with proper/poor sex education being one of the biggest factors in that.)

Yup. Premarital sex had much higher costs before condoms and antibiotics, so societies developed taboos against it. Because taboos have a certain inertia, once it came into existence it can continue to exist even when there's no longer a good reason for it.
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: guizonde on December 15, 2015, 10:34:44 pm
I don't know, but I heard a theory that the taboo came about because of STDs.
I assume that the taboo came because of children being born out of wedlock. Go back several centuries and in much of the world if an unmarried woman got pregnant she was much less likely to find a suitor and raising the child and supporting her would be the responsibility of her family (if she didn't simply get disowned.) And with less chances of employment or welfare, raising kids on your own wasn't that easy either.

Nowadays in most countries single mother can actually get jobs and/or raise a child on her own and it is much less of a horrible stain to marry someone (particularly a woman) who already has kids. But I suppose some folks are still old fashioned.

EDIT: Of course contraceptives are also better these days so accidental pregnancies are rarer as well. (with proper/poor sex education being one of the biggest factors in that.)

Yup. Premarital sex had much higher costs before condoms and antibiotics, so societies developed taboos against it. Because taboos have a certain inertia, once it came into existence it can continue to exist even when there's no longer a good reason for it.

i thought that was what orphanages, rivers, and sandwiches were for. getting rid of unwanted babies, that is.
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: mellenORL on December 15, 2015, 11:14:08 pm
When ancient people figured out that only one specific man is the father of a baby,  marriage became a ritual. They previously thought women either spontaneously got preggers (the fertility gods/goddesses were the instigators), or that the sex act itself, regardless how many partners, and not sperm specific to a certain man, caused pregnancy. Very primitive tribes today hold the old beliefs, or did until contacted by anthropologists. In the Abrahamic traditions, you see where women are chattel in marriage, subject to death for infidelity, to assure primogeniture and secondary inheritance rights by the actual sons of the husband, regardless how many wives and concubines he had.
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: I am lizard on December 16, 2015, 12:30:11 am
When ancient people figured out that only one specific man is the father of a baby,  marriage became a ritual. They previously thought women either spontaneously got preggers (the fertility gods/goddesses were the instigators), or that the sex act itself, regardless how many partners, and not sperm specific to a certain man, caused pregnancy. Very primitive tribes today hold the old beliefs, or did until contacted by anthropologists. In the Abrahamic traditions, you see where women are chattel in marriage, subject to death for infidelity, to assure primogeniture and secondary inheritance rights by the actual sons of the husband, regardless how many wives and concubines he had.
Things got simpler after the invention of mandatory child support.
Title: Re: Women banned from homeless shelter ...because Bible
Post by: Askold on December 16, 2015, 02:57:21 am
...And then we have that one culture where people realized that since they can't examine the DNA of the child they cannot actually verify who the father is. Therefore women are allowed to fuck whoever they want and there is no marriage but instead the uncles help raise the kids. That way they can be certain that the child is related to them through as a nephew at least, while a married man whose wife cheated on him might end up raising a child who isn't related to him.