FSTDT Forums
General Category => Forum Games => Topic started by: Oriet on February 06, 2012, 06:47:50 pm
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I know people are already aware of this, but I will say it myself so there will be no doubt.
I find I must leave FSTDT, and I don't know if I'll ever be back.
I used to love this site. I really did. I did what I could to help keep it running the way that myself and others liked, by encouraging rational discussion about all sorts of topics. There were always periods where there'd be more or less rationality on average, but it was the best place for it that I could find, especially that was able to talk about such a wide variety of topics. Things would often get heated and flames would fly, but it was almost always able to be resolved through rational discussion.
This is no longer the case. Somehow, over the course of months or years as membership slowly changed as people came and went, the community as a whole shifted. Because it was gradual it went largely unnoticed, only becoming visible when the forum would get hit by a shitstorm. I don't know when rationality went out of vogue. I don't know when it became perfectly fine for large numbers of forumites to outright admit to not having rationality and somehow expect to not have any dissenting opinion on such allowed. It used to be that we would tackle the points people actually made in a topic, quoting it and pointing out mistakes or showing how it doesn't say what they mean; now people outright admit their arguments are based on "chasing shadows of strawmen", that the opposition is actually correct, but patting themselves on the back for being the victor in throwing the most insults, having the most dickish behaviour, and getting away with the most rules violations.
I love rationality, but the amount of it on the forum has been dropping at an ever increasing rate. I hate argumentation so bad it can't even be called argumentation, I hate outright contradictions within individual posts, I hate people railing against someone for some perceived slight while engaging in far worse behaviour to do so, yet all of that has been on the rise. I remember when facts and logic won debates, now it's shifting to whomever can make the best passive aggressive, completely non sequitor personal first. I do not know why this has happened, as I've even tried to fight against such when I noticed it, but here we are.
I still do not know what people feel I have done wrong that they feel justified in attacking almost every aspect of my being. I don't know what slight I committed that made people rely on talking as though I'm not there when I've been participating. I do not know when people felt my questions and concerns were not even worth and "I'm not gonna tell ya 'cause you're a doodie-head."
I've asked people why they were attacking me, yet no one bothered to respond with anything beyond more attacks. I even had to face all of this from a fellow moderator, who again never had the decency to address any of my questions or concerns. I don't know why people feel I would put up with this sort of nonsense when many know quite well that I didn't put up with it from my relatives, whom I had been quite close to.
If you've actually bothered to read this far instead of going "TL;DR" then I thank you. I will miss many people here. There are also many I will not miss at all, some of whom I would have missed had I not seen them cheering for my leaving and having moderator status removed. As everyone should be aware, the last bit of problems started here (http://forums.fstdt.net/politics-and-government/regulate-sugar-like-alcohol-and-cigarettes/) and eventually moved over to here (http://forums.fstdt.net/flame-and-burn/vene%27s-being-a-dick/), which then later spawned this (http://forums.fstdt.net/flame-and-burn/you-are-all-idiots/). If you actually want to understand my reasons for leaving you cannot just say "tl;dr" and expect a synopsis, as far too much happened for that. Those threads and the IRC (the logs of which can be found in various threads) are not the only reasons I'm leaving. There was never an official rule made against this, and considering how important for understanding I feel it to be I will post part of the conversation from the mod room (http://houserulegaming.com/permaimages/Moderator%20Conduct_1328462884019.png). Sandman, if you feel I overstepped my bounds I apologise and understand fully if you remove it, but as I said I do feel it has an important piece to why I no longer feel welcomed in this community, and wish to at least give people the opportunity to see it.
I would say I will miss coming here, but it's unfortunately already a past event. I miss what this forum used to be like (even when Skyfire, Julian, or FMG were causing problems), and I still wish I knew what I did wrong to be as insulted and slighted as what seems to be half the forum has been directing at me, but I can tell that on the whole I am not welcomed (for whatever reason) and instead of taking the abuse I will simply make my exit.
~Oriet
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Somehow, over the course of months or years as membership slowly changed as people came and went, the community as a whole shifted.
I've noticed this shift and I'm pretty sad about it. I will miss you, Oriet.
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Oriet has pretty much summed up my feelings about FSTDT these days.
I'm not leaving quite yet. I definitely am too curious as to what is going to happen to leave right now. However, I can see myself not being around here in the not-too-distant future.
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I'm sad to see you go, Oriet. Same with Nappy leaving. Same with Vene leaving, if he's doing that. I'm not actually clear one way or the other with respect to him. I've noticed the kind of change you're talking about, and if you feel like leaving, at this point, is the right option for you then godspeed and good luck. Again, same to Vene if that applies.
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Why would I object? I have nothing to hide. Never did. If you are referring to the Kitt comment, do I need to explain that I in no way hold Kitt's disagreement with me against him? I hope you'll come back, I always did like you.
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I am sorry it came to this, Oriet. I certainly understand why you feel the way you do, and I feel the same way. A lot has changed, and I don't even know when it happened.
I'm going to miss seeing you around the forum. You were one of the first people I started recognizing when I first came to FSTDT.
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I am sorry it came to this, Oriet. I certainly understand why you feel the way you do, and I feel the same way. A lot has changed, and I don't even know when it happened.
I'm going to miss seeing you around the forum. You were one of the first people I started recognizing when I first came to FSTDT.
This. I hope you come back later when shit settles down.
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It really should not have come to this but a few pushed too hard and many good regulars left as a result. I had contemplate leaving because I didn't like the idea of pushing others to leave simply over disagreement but I chose to stay because I have made a niche here.
(http://chzpokememes.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/pokmon-bye-bye-butterfree-go-do-sex.gif)
/me hugs Oriet
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I'm sad to see you go, Oriet. Same with Nappy leaving. Same with Vene leaving, if he's doing that. I'm not actually clear one way or the other with respect to him. I've noticed the kind of change you're talking about, and if you feel like leaving, at this point, is the right option for you then godspeed and good luck. Again, same to Vene if that applies.
I'll miss you too. Even though I'm relatively new, when I used to lurk, I found you three to be very intelligent people and hoped one day to contribute with you in discussion. I've also looked up to you (Oriet) in particular as a sort of trans-role-model. Again, sorry to see you go before we could get to know one another better and I sincerely wish you the best and would like to see you on FSTDT again someday.
EDIT@ Gyeonghwa (and other users who have made similar statements): It would really make a bad situation worse and sadden me to see you leave :(
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Everyone else has said what I wanted to say. I do hope you decide to return some day, but regardless if that happens or not, take care. :'(
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Don't worry, QueenofHearts. I'll stay because there is still a sense of community for me here. Admittedly, it won't garner the same intimacy or trust as it did before, but I just want to see it get back on it's feet again.
/me hugs
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I just wanted to say I am very sorry to see you and Vene go. You were/ are two of my favourite forumites and my only suppliers of avatars.
I really hope it gets to the point where you can come back.
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I'm really sorry to hear that you're leaving. I know you and I have never really had the chance to get to know one another (something I regret, in hindsight), but I've always had a ton of respect for you as a mod and a fellow member. You've been an invaluable asset to the community, and will definitely be missed.
No matter what happens, I wish you and all of the members who have chosen to leave the very best. Take care, Oriet. *hug*
Edit: I am unsure if Vene is leaving, but if he is, all of the above (sans the bits about moderation, of course) apply to him as well. I have a ton of respect for both of you.
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While I disagree - vehemently - with your assessment of FSTDT, I can say this: Of all the people who said crazy shit last night, you were not one of them. I honestly don't know you that well, but I hope you see fit to return at some point.
Cheers.
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Goodbye, Oriet. I hope you and everyone else come back some day.
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(http://virtualfuture.info/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/goodbye1.jpg)
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All I can say, simply, is that I share the sentiment of others who posted. All of you were my friends. All of you were people that I looked up to, and was honestly elated to even hold conversation with, and I greatly appreciate that I ever even knew you at all.
It never should have gotten to the point that it did, but...now I suppose all we can do is hope that you can all return at some point. That these wounds, though deep, can heal.
Goodbye, all of you. FSTDT will never be the same without you.
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Somehow, over the course of months or years as membership slowly changed as people came and went, the community as a whole shifted.
I've noticed this shift and I'm pretty sad about it. I will miss you, Oriet.
Likewise. The board is poorer for losing Oriet. :(
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Somehow, over the course of months or years as membership slowly changed as people came and went, the community as a whole shifted.
I've noticed this shift and I'm pretty sad about it. I will miss you, Oriet.
Likewise. The board is poorer for losing Oriet. :(
Ditto on noticing a change in atmosphere. I still think this site is a step above most, though.
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I'll miss you Oriet, I've had a deep respect for you and the community will never be the same without you.
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I'll miss you Oriet, I've had a deep respect for you and the community will never be the same without you.
This. Oriet, Vene, Nappy...all good people and good members. Frankly, they aren't the only ones who have dropped off due to the shift over the last year or so (or since board change). They are simply the most visible.
Oddly, I had already been on my way out and this shit actually made me start checking again for the last couple of days. I'm currently composing my "one last thing" (it will actually take a few days due to being busy in RL and wanting to get it exactly right) and then I'll be gone too.
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It's a shame you got mixed up in the crap that happened over the weekend, Oriet. I don't want to have to see you leave, hopefully you'll rejoin us some day. In the meantime, best of luck.
And that screencap. God damn it Shane.
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I suppose I ought to just add on to this thread that I'm done with FSTDT too. I joined relatively late in the game, but it just doesn't seem like my sort of place any more. So... seeya.
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I suppose I ought to just add on to this thread that I'm done with FSTDT too. I joined relatively late in the game, but it just doesn't seem like my sort of place any more. So... seeya.
(http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/219/807/1324345921001.png)
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I really don't see why everyone is abandoning ship?? I see a little change in the forum, that's it, nothing major.
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:(
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I swear, by the power of Lithp, one day I will find a way to bring you all back.
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A mod, admin, and two members leaving is jarring, to be sure...but its no reason to abandon the forum. Things are a bit madhouse in certain places, and with certain people, but it'll come back under control soon enough...
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It's a shame all of you left. It seems all of the awesome people I met as a newbie back in the Yahweh days of the forum are almost all gone from the forum. Still, if you're no longer happy here then there's no reason to stick around purely out of habit or tradition.
In any case, I wish y'all the best and hope that you'll see fit to return once the drama has cooled off.
Toodles.
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A mod, admin, and two members leaving is jarring, to be sure...but its no reason to abandon the forum. Things are a bit madhouse in certain places, and with certain people, but it'll come back under control soon enough...
I don't think the departures are because of the recent drama, exactly. I think that explosion was more reflective of deeper issues or conflicts that would have had to come to a head sooner or later. It didn't have to be in that exact manner, but it did make these departures much more noticeable. Mira, Bezron, and others say that they had been considering leaving for some time. This was just the proverbial straw.
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I really don't see why everyone is abandoning ship?? I see a little change in the forum, that's it, nothing major.
Not everyone, just a few people who are having trouble seeing the forest for the trees.
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I think it's more a matter of different people having different desires for what they want in a community. I'm sad to see so many people leaving, of course, and I hope that they'll reconsider their decision, but I don't judge them for going if they no longer find it enjoyable to be here.
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Such a shame a lot of members are leaving the community. I may have joined FSTDT much later compared to the majority of the userbase, and I may have missed most of the drama, but I'm still rather saddened to see such fine members leaving.
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A mod, admin, and two members leaving is jarring, to be sure...but its no reason to abandon the forum. Things are a bit madhouse in certain places, and with certain people, but it'll come back under control soon enough...
I don't think the departures are because of the recent drama, exactly. I think that explosion was more reflective of deeper issues or conflicts that would have had to come to a head sooner or later. It didn't have to be in that exact manner, but it did make these departures much more noticeable. Mira, Bezron, and others say that they had been considering leaving for some time. This was just the proverbial straw.
True that...true that...
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(http://30.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lz1g90GSmp1qmqf0fo1_500.jpg)
All I will say to those leaving. If they wish to return, they are welcome to, I'm sure.
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I really don't see why everyone is abandoning ship?? I see a little change in the forum, that's it, nothing major.
Not everyone, just a few people who are having trouble seeing the forest for the trees.
Really? You're gonna use that tone in terms of people who have been here for years? Really? Really?
Ironbite-wow.
ETA: Again I'm not trying to fan flames here but I really take umbrage to someone who's been on here for weeks saying something like that to people who have/had been here for years. That's all.
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I'm sad to see people are wanting to leave, but if they want to, they should. Forums should be places you feel like you can enjoy spending time in. Life is full of experiences that you have to just go through time and time again, talk to people you don't like, over and over. An internet forum shouldn't be one of them. I hope everyone who has left feels like they can come back someday, but if being here is really that miserable, don't stay, because it isn't worth your sanity.
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Ironbite, please let the matter be. Yes, Eniliad shouldn't have used that tone but you are just helping him to keep the drama alive. Can't both of you just let it go?
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Forums change over time. This forum has changed quite a bit from when I first started. It use to be fairly self regulating. That however ended when some people decided to bring issues with others from one thread to another. So we got more active Mods.
Since then, at little fault of the mods or admins , there has been less and less real discussion of issues and topics. If a person does not share the same outlook as most other posters they are jumped on, looked at as the new forum chew toy.
It is no one persons fault, it is everyone’s.
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I really don't see why everyone is abandoning ship?? I see a little change in the forum, that's it, nothing major.
Not everyone, just a few people who are having trouble seeing the forest for the trees.
Really? You're gonna use that tone in terms of people who have been here for years? Really? Really?
Ironbite-wow.
ETA: Again I'm not trying to fan flames here but I really take umbrage to someone who's been on here for weeks saying something like that to people who have/had been here for years. That's all.
IB? You know me. You know that I don't fly off all half-cocked on the boards, so realize that when I say this. Just because you have been here longer does not make you any more relevant or insightful than someone newer. I will not have FSTDT turn into one of those boards where old-time members routinely "pull rank" on newbies and tell them that they may not have an opinion or make a statement because of their relative newness. There are more than a few grains of truth in what Eniliad said, and you don't get to pull a "Really?" out of your ass just because you believe you have some kind of seniority here.
On FSTDT, all voices are valued, not just those who have been around longest. I know that it has not always been like that, but this is what we are building.
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ETA: Again I'm not trying to fan flames here but I really take umbrage to someone who's been on here for weeks saying something like that to people who have/had been here for years. That's all.
Just because I happen to have the kerosene on hand.
From my review of everything the majority of this particular shit fit was because of people who had been here for quite some time(Though that Heil line Eniliad made was funny to me, it certainly didn't help). How long you've been somewhere doesn't have much to do with how right you are. A lot like how being a mod doesn't make you infallible.
I'm honestly pretty tried of the seniority and herd mentalities that have cropped around here, those are largely the reasons I handed the forums off to Nap. So odds are I'll be kicking over a few stones as things come to mind just to get some actual discussion happening around here, rather than the herd charging into the angrydome once more. I invite others to do so as well, just remember the difference between actual issue and personal attack.
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I really don't see why everyone is abandoning ship?? I see a little change in the forum, that's it, nothing major.
Not everyone, just a few people who are having trouble seeing the forest for the trees.
You've only been posting here for about three weeks, Eniliad. It's hard to really have much perspective on this unless you've been around for a bit.
Not trying to pull the seniority card or anything, just saying that you probably don't have the most insightful perspective on this.
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I really don't see why everyone is abandoning ship?? I see a little change in the forum, that's it, nothing major.
Not everyone, just a few people who are having trouble seeing the forest for the trees.
You've only been posting here for about three weeks, Eniliad. It's hard to really have much perspective on this unless you've been around for a bit.
Did you even read Sandman's post?
Not trying to pull the seniority card or anything
meaning the opposite.
Oh, I also notice that he has 442 posts, and you have 98...
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Yes, I did read Sandman's post.
I do not, however, think that someone who has been around for less than a month can make any remark regarding whether the forums have changed.
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Yes, I did read Sandman's post.
I do not, however, think that someone who has been around for less than a month can make any remark regarding whether the forums have changed.
It depends on how rapidly they're changing, which, I think most people will agree, was very rapid lately.
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That's the thing, the forums haven't really changed a ton in the past month. These incidents are simply the culmination of more gradual changes.
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It depends on how rapidly they're changing, which, I think most people will agree, was very rapid lately.
I would not agree. I've been feeling a change for close to a year now. I don't think this month has been much different from the other months.
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Ok, let's all take a breather here, I really don't want my observation to be turned into more drama
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It depends on how rapidly they're changing, which, I think most people will agree, was very rapid lately.
I would not agree. I've been feeling a change for close to a year now. I don't think this month has been much different from the other months.
I've stayed out of this except for reading the threads, but I'm going to weigh in here to say that I've seen dramatic change over the years since I first came to FSTDT. Most of the people that were here when I first joined are gone now and most of the more prolific current posters are all "newbies" to me, even those that have been here for two or three years. I've seen the content and tone of posts change greatly over the years and had even left for a while myself. I had only come back and started posting again a few months before the move here.
When I first joined back in the Yahweh days, I posted quite often, but over the past three or four years, I've not been nearly as prodigious a poster as a lot of you although I'm logged on most all the time. Quite honestly, a lot of the things that are posted now are of no real interest to me. I may be enticed by a thread title, but when I start reading it, meh, I'll quit reading after a few of the posts. But there have been many times that I have started to respond in a thread, had it typed out, and while reviewing it, wondered to myself how much I was going to be flamed for simply disagreeing with or stating an opinion that differed from certain others. I've seen it happen too many times and have, in fact, had it happen to me a couple of times. After considering this, I would then hit the back button and just leave it at that.
As for this latest shitfest, I'm not taking sides. There are people on both sides of this thing that I like and some that I'm not very fond of. I'm not saying who's who as that would be counter-productive and pointless.
But the point being, after all this being said, is this is not a recent thing. In my opinion, it's been gradually growing, not for months, but years. But I can understand how some of the newer members may not see how things have changed since they joined.
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Okay, a few things:
1. I apologize for my "Seig Heil" at Napoleon. It was tasteless, and by that point, my temper truly had gotten the better of me.
2. No, I'm not saying that I'm an expert on the forums by being here three weeks. I realize I can't give my perspective on the boards as a whole, just as I can't give any insight into Napoleon's abilities as a mod/admin pre-Incident. But just because I only have a more recent perspective doesn't mean that I can't call it like I see it. And the way I see it, the people who have abandoned ship seem to think this event is an earth-shattering, catastrophic event. In truth... it sucked, but FSTDT isn't really all that damaged for it; we still have order, we still have mods in control of the board, and life goes on beyond the Incident. That's the "forest" I referred to, and the people who can't see that the boards are, overall, fine, are unable to see it for the Trees of Drama.
That's all I meant by it, by the way. It wasn't a personal attack, a sleight, or anything else. I hope that at some point, they gain a bit more perspective and return. Most if not all of them are still welcome, I think, judging by posts made in this thread.
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I was here during the Yahweh days, and while I have noticed somewhat of a shift in the forum, it's not as obvious to me because I don't frequent the R&P/P&G sections as much. That's partially because I dislike the "let's all gang up on this person for not having the same view as us." Another reason is some of the articles in the threads there are things I've already read about that warrant little more than "FUUUUUCK" in response, so they're just not as useful. I don't want to re-read it send myself into a blinding rage again.
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When I first joined back in the Yahweh days, I posted quite often, but over the past three or four years, I've not been nearly as prodigious a poster as a lot of you although I'm logged on most all the time. Quite honestly, a lot of the things that are posted now are of no real interest to me. I may be enticed by a thread title, but when I start reading it, meh, I'll quit reading after a few of the posts. But there have been many times that I have started to respond in a thread, had it typed out, and while reviewing it, wondered to myself how much I was going to be flamed for simply disagreeing with or stating an opinion that differed from certain others. I've seen it happen too many times and have, in fact, had it happen to me a couple of times. After considering this, I would then hit the back button and just leave it at that.
I swear I'm not trying to start a fight here, and you were around longer than I was, but how much different is this from the Redhunter/Julian kill team assigned to any newb on the Yahweh forums? I still remember getting my ass chewed out for things that I'm fairly sure I didn't even say.
That said, I'll happily punt people around for flaming just because someone dissagrees over something, but you can't really expect everything you say to go unchallenged either. Part of reasoning things out is challenging beliefs.
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I really don't see why everyone is abandoning ship?? I see a little change in the forum, that's it, nothing major.
Not everyone, just a few people who are having trouble seeing the forest for the trees.
One bad tree can destroy an entire forest. Just saying. The OP noted that people couldn't see the problem because it only appear when drama flared up.
Whether or not you agree is at your own discretion.
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gye, what's with you? You're getting awful pessimistic. Really, this is a minor thing in the long run!
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When I first joined back in the Yahweh days, I posted quite often, but over the past three or four years, I've not been nearly as prodigious a poster as a lot of you although I'm logged on most all the time. Quite honestly, a lot of the things that are posted now are of no real interest to me. I may be enticed by a thread title, but when I start reading it, meh, I'll quit reading after a few of the posts. But there have been many times that I have started to respond in a thread, had it typed out, and while reviewing it, wondered to myself how much I was going to be flamed for simply disagreeing with or stating an opinion that differed from certain others. I've seen it happen too many times and have, in fact, had it happen to me a couple of times. After considering this, I would then hit the back button and just leave it at that.
I swear I'm not trying to start a fight here, and you were around longer than I was, but how much different is this from the Redhunter/Julian kill team assigned to any newb on the Yahweh forums? I still remember getting my ass chewed out for things that I'm fairly sure I didn't even say.
That said, I'll happily punt people around for flaming just because someone dissagrees over something, but you can't really expect everything you say to go unchallenged either. Part of reasoning things out is challenging beliefs.
I'm not sure I quite follow you about the Redhunter/Julian kill team (Julian was already here when I joined and Red joined about the same time I did) or the ass-chewings you are referring to. But it just seemed to me that things were a little more "relaxed" back then. And by that, I mean we were more jovial with each other instead of having to be so guarded about what we say. The only ones I really remember us getting into arguments with was the occasional fundie that came by, such as BigChrisFilm and Carico, just to name a couple. And I guess that's part of the problem. We just don't have that many fundies come around anymore to kick around, so people have started going after each other. And maybe it's selective memory, but I just don't remember too many arguments between the regular forum members at the time I signed up. I know Julian could be get rather colorful with his tirades, but it was a while after I joined that I really remember one of his directed at a regular.
Anyway, just my opinion and recollection. I'm not trying to stir up shit or argue with you or anyone else. All I know is, for me, it's just not as fun as it used to be around here.
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gye, what's with you? You're getting awful pessimistic. Really, this is a minor thing in the long run!
This whole fiasco where there was an underlying problem that wasn't address and resulted in an entire community going ka-boom isn't new too me. It happened once before in another online community and once again in a real life group.
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gye, what's with you? You're getting awful pessimistic. Really, this is a minor thing in the long run!
This whole fiasco where there was an underlying problem that wasn't address and resulted in an entire community going ka-boom isn't new too me. It happened once before in another online community and once again in a real life group.
Please, do tell...
Story time, everyone!
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If you're familiar with Pharyngula, the community there split in two.
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If you're familiar with Pharyngula, the community there split in two.
Oh, do go on...
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It's complicated. And the drama there didn't exactly end so if I elaborate I'm going end up calling someone (from there) a venomous attention-whoring something or rather.
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...you do realize the drama on the forum, other than your doomsaying, is dying off, right?
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...you do realize the drama on the forum, other than your doomsaying, is dying off, right?
The drama is. The underlying cause for the drama remains.
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...you do realize the drama on the forum, other than your doomsaying, is dying off, right?
The drama is. The underlying cause for the drama remains.
This. Simply that the flames have faded doesn't mean the underlying problem isn't there anymore.
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While a long-time member, I was never a huge contributor to the site. With Oriet and a few other users I would frequently interact with leaving, that does in a way force me to move on as well. I have preferred to speak over chat anyway, which is probably where I will stay.
This doesn't absolve me of any agreements with Keiro and Miles of course. And I do look froward to meetings beyond fstdt with CaseAgainstFaith, Distind, JJ, SImSim, Hades, Mira, Vene, Oriet & family, be it work or personal.
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...you do realize the drama on the forum, other than your doomsaying, is dying off, right?
The drama is. The underlying cause for the drama remains.
This. Simply that the flames have faded doesn't mean the underlying problem isn't there anymore.
Okay, fine. Keep your doom and gloom.
The rest of us will be over here enjoying the forum, thanks.
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Stating that there is a problem doesn't equate "doom and gloom". It's stating the problem. If anything, it seems you are over analyzing this and making it into something it's not, in a perverse attempt to avoid the problem.
Also you're attempting to be dismissive (and even belittling) of others. Their observation at this point is just as valid as yours.
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FFS.
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(http://26.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lqc4xsLfVe1r0k5nro1_500.gif)
All of you just calm down. Eniliad, I appreciate what you're saying but remember what I told you. Don't answer people. Gye, I appreciate what you have to say, too. But it's not helping either.
All of the rest of you just take five, find a cold beer or soda, and relax. Then hug it out. Because people who want to leave won't be swayed to stay. And they shouldn't be. People who want to leave, can. I just request we don't foster an 'us vs. them' mentality. It does nobody any good.
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While a long-time member, I was never a huge contributor to the site. With Oriet and a few other users I would frequently interact with leaving, that does in a way force me to move on as well. I have preferred to speak over chat anyway, which is probably where I will stay.
This doesn't absolve me of any agreements with Keiro and Miles of course. And I do look froward to meetings beyond fstdt with CaseAgainstFaith, Distind, JJ, SImSim, Hades, Mira, Vene, Oriet & family, be it work or personal.
I hope to see you around the IRC.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0cVlTeIATBs
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(http://26.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lqc4xsLfVe1r0k5nro1_500.gif)
All of you just calm down. Eniliad, I appreciate what you're saying but remember what I told you. Don't answer people. Gye, I appreciate what you have to say, too. But it's not helping either.
All of the rest of you just take five, find a cold beer or soda, and relax. Then hug it out. Because people who want to leave won't be swayed to stay. And they shouldn't be. People who want to leave, can. I just request we don't foster an 'us vs. them' mentality. It does nobody any good.
"FFS" was directed at the continued bickering, not the people leaving, for the record.
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I didn't even see your FFS when I was posting. :P But I also figured that was the case. You know you're my girl. <3
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All of you just calm down.
Honestly? I'm trying, but bullshit like this is making it difficult. Had the people saying this now had this position 2 or 3 days ago, things might not have gotten to this point. I literally do not care if you think I'm "keeping drama alive" by saying that. If you're so offended by what you did, here's a thought; instead of trying to sweep it under the rug, don't do it again.
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I'm not even bickering. That was literally my first post at all in regards to what happened. You're welcome to disagree, but I do pre-date roughly 90% of the people in this thread, and I've felt the change in atmosphere that is relatively recent. It's not quite enough to drive me away, but it has effectively made it so a good chunk of the people who were cornerstones of this community have left.
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Locking thread as this thread has completely lost its purpose and now only serves to promote a negative atmosphere.
Edit: Any threads started up to continue the nature of this thread will be immediately locked.
Edit 2: A thread has been started to facilitate the reparation of the issue, rather than continuing in this manner: http://forums.fstdt.net/flame-and-burn/recent-events/