Author Topic: Gay marriage legalized in Britain.  (Read 9469 times)

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Offline PosthumanHeresy

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Re: Gay marriage legalized in Britain.
« Reply #30 on: July 19, 2013, 01:02:25 am »
Hagan, I think he's talking extremely historically. As in, before the English sailed over.
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Offline Katsuro

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Re: Gay marriage legalized in Britain.
« Reply #31 on: July 19, 2013, 04:27:08 am »
Northern Ireland will either take 25 years to legalise it or their gonna have to be forced somehow. The place doesn't deserve the level of autonomy it has.

Yeah but it was basically either that or continue blowing eachother up.  What would you rather the British government had done?

Having grown up in Northern Ireland during the "blow eachother up" phase I think re-instating the Northern Irish Assembly was preferable, as much as I despise most Assembly members.  So far my house has yet to be shaken by another bomb blast, no husband of my mother's work friends have lost anymore body parts from people putting bombs under their cars for no reason other than they were a cop and no more children from the schools I went to have been shot dead for the crime of having a catholic friend.  So that's progress.  We may not have reached the 21st century yet but we'll get their some day.  Probably when everyone else is in the 25th century.

I am serious by the way, those were the two options.  There was a 3rd option - unify Ireland and give Northern Ireland back to the Republic but I don't think I need to explain why that would have been a disaster that would have caused the deaths of thousands of people.

'Back to the Republic'? It was never part of the Republic of Ireland.

For fuck sake, are you serious or are you winding me up?  That's not what I meant and I think you probably knew that.
I do have a BA in History by the way, I don't need pedantic patronisations that in no way change the point I was making.

I said giving it back to the Republic as a turn of phrase.  I simply meant giving Northern Ireland to what is now called the Republic of Ireland and re-uniting Ireland into being a single entity as it once was, before the Free State was established (albeit obviously with the whole of Ireland independant and not under direct British rule as the whole Island had been before 1921).

I'm perfectly aware Northern Ireland was never part of the modern state now known as the Republic of Ireland, nor was it part of the Free State and the the two have been separate since 1921 (and yes I do know the Free State didn't come into being until 1922 due to the cival war before you say anything) - although technically Northern Ireland was actually part of the Free State initially when it was first established but NI chose to remove itself.  So there was probably a few hours at least where NI was part of the Free State if we want to get REALLY pedantic about things.

And yeah the political situation here is less than perfect or ideal and we have far too many fundies and former terrorists in government than I'd like (I'd like none of either) but it's a neceassary evil.  And don't get me started on the fuckin' DUP.   My dad is from the Shankhill and I went to school in Monkstown and Glengormley, but I'd vote Sinn Feinn before I'd vote DUP that's how much the DUP pisses me off.  I'm dead serious.

Edit:  I think I over reacted a bit here (I do that sometimes, I dunno if I'm bi-polar or something, do bi-polar people do that?  I knew a girl once who was bi-polar and did similar things).  But I'll leave this post as is as it seems dishonest to change it after people have already read it.
« Last Edit: July 19, 2013, 04:33:35 am by Katsuro »

Offline Katsuro

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Re: Gay marriage legalized in Britain.
« Reply #32 on: July 19, 2013, 04:31:21 am »

Honestly as its part of the UK right now Id rather it was mostly ruled from Westminster and had much less choice over what it does. I'm Northern Irish too. Born and raised in Derry.

Huh, I never thought I'd met someone who calls Londonderry "Derry" but also says as things are now they'd rather NI was ruled more directly by Westminster  - I'm so confused! Lol.

Offline Katsuro

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Re: Gay marriage legalized in Britain.
« Reply #33 on: July 19, 2013, 04:47:48 am »

It really was that bad? My ex always claimed his bio-parents gave him up because of the violence in Ireland in the late 80s. I chalked it up to wishful thinking. Now...not so sure.

At times yes.  I was lucky enough to have not been alive during the worst of The Troubles but even when I was a kid in the late 80's and early 90's incedents were common and soldiers patrolling the streets was normal every day sight, they did it as matter of course the same as you see bobbies walking the streets of London (or you used to, last time I was in london I didn't see any foot patrol bobbies).

To give you a vague idea of what NI used to be like here's a few old photos of RUC (police) stations:







Most now have taken down some of the higher fencing and corregated iron, but they still look more like a baracks on the outside than a police station.  You still have to push a buzzer to be let in through a double security door system in order to get in (after they've had a good long look at you on the CCTV system first) for most of them.  I think most of them, you do with my local statio at least and it's not even in a particularly bad area.


Offline Diamandahagan

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Re: Gay marriage legalized in Britain.
« Reply #34 on: July 19, 2013, 08:12:30 am »

Honestly as its part of the UK right now Id rather it was mostly ruled from Westminster and had much less choice over what it does. I'm Northern Irish too. Born and raised in Derry.

Huh, I never thought I'd met someone who calls Londonderry "Derry" but also says as things are now they'd rather NI was ruled more directly by Westminster  - I'm so confused! Lol.

If you think thats weird there was at least one loyalist kid who accidentilly killed themself while trying to bomb Catholic kids. They were buried in their fave football shirt (a Celtic top).

Hagan, I think he's talking extremely historically. As in, before the English sailed over.

Oh around the time the Irish 'Scots' tribe invaded and conquered the Picts and formed Scotland? Because the Scots 'sailed over' with the English. And that sailing happened around the time of full-scale colonisation of North America. There have been fuckload of happily British people in Ireland since before the creation of the USA. If you're gonna call for Irish unification over their heads then you really should call for the USA to be handed over to the remaining native American tribes.

The Northern Ireland issue is complicated. VERY complicated and neither side are heroes, villains, victims or aggressors more than the other. It being reduced to 'British bad and hurt Irish' is ridiculous.

If Northern Ireland was capable of voting in a sane government then Id be happy with them having one. But alas we generally have the choice between ex-terrorists/ ex-terrorist apologists or right-wing christian fundies. If your govt was made up primarily of Timothy McVeighs and Kent Hovinds you might think similarly.
« Last Edit: July 19, 2013, 08:15:16 am by Diamandahagan »

Offline Katsuro

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Re: Gay marriage legalized in Britain.
« Reply #35 on: July 19, 2013, 08:50:53 am »
This is why I vote Alliance as my 1st choice.  They sure as fuck aren't the perfect political party but at least they're generally neither murderers nor fundies and tend to try and stay away from the whole sectarian devide thing.

Basically there isn't anyone else worth voting for, it's once again a case of not so much voting for who you want to win but instead not voting for who you don't want to win. And so many people vote Sinn Fein and DUP my Alliance vote is as near meaningless as makes no difference.

Offline Katsuro

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Re: Gay marriage legalized in Britain.
« Reply #36 on: July 19, 2013, 09:08:54 am »

Honestly as its part of the UK right now Id rather it was mostly ruled from Westminster and had much less choice over what it does. I'm Northern Irish too. Born and raised in Derry.

Huh, I never thought I'd met someone who calls Londonderry "Derry" but also says as things are now they'd rather NI was ruled more directly by Westminster  - I'm so confused! Lol.

If you think thats weird there was at least one loyalist kid who accidentilly killed themself while trying to bomb Catholic kids. They were buried in their fave football shirt (a Celtic top).


I think I've something just as confusing.  My dad - a Shankhill Road man born and bred whose only opinion on the JFK assassination was the wonderfully deep and insightful "he was a Papist" and when asked by some researcher on his doorstep, "Nationality...British?" replied with, "I should fucking well hope so!" - during his nursing training years in England was best friends with a Northern Irish catholic named Pat whose family were known members of the IRA and who was picked up and questioned by Special Branch every single time there was an IRA attack in England.  And I do mean BEST friends, they were apparently inseperable.

Offline PosthumanHeresy

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Re: Gay marriage legalized in Britain.
« Reply #37 on: July 19, 2013, 10:46:52 am »

Honestly as its part of the UK right now Id rather it was mostly ruled from Westminster and had much less choice over what it does. I'm Northern Irish too. Born and raised in Derry.

Huh, I never thought I'd met someone who calls Londonderry "Derry" but also says as things are now they'd rather NI was ruled more directly by Westminster  - I'm so confused! Lol.

If you think thats weird there was at least one loyalist kid who accidentilly killed themself while trying to bomb Catholic kids. They were buried in their fave football shirt (a Celtic top).

Hagan, I think he's talking extremely historically. As in, before the English sailed over.

Oh around the time the Irish 'Scots' tribe invaded and conquered the Picts and formed Scotland? Because the Scots 'sailed over' with the English. And that sailing happened around the time of full-scale colonisation of North America. There have been fuckload of happily British people in Ireland since before the creation of the USA. If you're gonna call for Irish unification over their heads then you really should call for the USA to be handed over to the remaining native American tribes.

The Northern Ireland issue is complicated. VERY complicated and neither side are heroes, villains, victims or aggressors more than the other. It being reduced to 'British bad and hurt Irish' is ridiculous.

If Northern Ireland was capable of voting in a sane government then Id be happy with them having one. But alas we generally have the choice between ex-terrorists/ ex-terrorist apologists or right-wing christian fundies. If your govt was made up primarily of Timothy McVeighs and Kent Hovinds you might think similarly.
I wasn't supporting anyone, I was just saying what I thought he intended. I think going that far back is rather silly, myself.
What I used to think was me is just a fading memory. I looked him right in the eye and said "Goodbye".
 - Trent Reznor, Down In It

Together as one, against all others.
- Marilyn Manson, Running To The Edge of The World

Humanity does learn from history,
sadly, they're rarely the ones in power.

Quote from: Ben Kuchera
Life is too damned short for the concept of “guilty” pleasures to have any meaning.

Offline Diamandahagan

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Re: Gay marriage legalized in Britain.
« Reply #38 on: July 19, 2013, 10:51:18 am »
Fair enough:) I think going back further than anyone involved was alive is silly myself.

Offline Katsuro

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Re: Gay marriage legalized in Britain.
« Reply #39 on: July 19, 2013, 11:05:20 am »

Honestly as its part of the UK right now Id rather it was mostly ruled from Westminster and had much less choice over what it does. I'm Northern Irish too. Born and raised in Derry.

Huh, I never thought I'd met someone who calls Londonderry "Derry" but also says as things are now they'd rather NI was ruled more directly by Westminster  - I'm so confused! Lol.

If you think thats weird there was at least one loyalist kid who accidentilly killed themself while trying to bomb Catholic kids. They were buried in their fave football shirt (a Celtic top).

Hagan, I think he's talking extremely historically. As in, before the English sailed over.

Oh around the time the Irish 'Scots' tribe invaded and conquered the Picts and formed Scotland? Because the Scots 'sailed over' with the English. And that sailing happened around the time of full-scale colonisation of North America. There have been fuckload of happily British people in Ireland since before the creation of the USA. If you're gonna call for Irish unification over their heads then you really should call for the USA to be handed over to the remaining native American tribes.

The Northern Ireland issue is complicated. VERY complicated and neither side are heroes, villains, victims or aggressors more than the other. It being reduced to 'British bad and hurt Irish' is ridiculous.

If Northern Ireland was capable of voting in a sane government then Id be happy with them having one. But alas we generally have the choice between ex-terrorists/ ex-terrorist apologists or right-wing christian fundies. If your govt was made up primarily of Timothy McVeighs and Kent Hovinds you might think similarly.
I wasn't supporting anyone, I was just saying what I thought he intended. I think going that far back is rather silly, myself.

Well I wasn't going that far back, I wasn't really talking about any specific time period I just meant re-uniting Ireland and chose a poor way of phrasing it.  I should learn that on the interwebs people won't let a poorly chosen turn of phrase go even when theyprobably know what you meant.  Real life is not like the internet.

Edit: I'm not having a go at anyone btw, I'm saying I should have chosen my words more carefully.
« Last Edit: July 19, 2013, 11:08:08 am by Katsuro »

Offline PosthumanHeresy

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Re: Gay marriage legalized in Britain.
« Reply #40 on: July 19, 2013, 12:50:16 pm »
I understand, and I actually didn't know you meant re-uniting Ireland, and simply thought you were going way far back. I can't speak for Hagan, though.
What I used to think was me is just a fading memory. I looked him right in the eye and said "Goodbye".
 - Trent Reznor, Down In It

Together as one, against all others.
- Marilyn Manson, Running To The Edge of The World

Humanity does learn from history,
sadly, they're rarely the ones in power.

Quote from: Ben Kuchera
Life is too damned short for the concept of “guilty” pleasures to have any meaning.

Offline Iconic Komodo Dragon 2

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Re: Gay marriage legalized in Britain.
« Reply #41 on: July 19, 2013, 04:13:39 pm »
I MAD ABOUT MEN-MEN AND GIRL-GIRL ARE OK FOR MARRIAGE! I HEARD FROM WITCH-DOCTOR THAT DEMONBIRDS NOW COME FROM SKY AND EAT US. WE MUST NO LET MEN-MEN MARRY OR VILLAGE NO-MORE!
« Last Edit: July 19, 2013, 04:20:25 pm by Iconic Komodo Dragon 2 »
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